POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Post general topics related to Nuendo 6 here.

Are you happy with the huge amount of clicking/scrolling in the new mixer?

No. Please change immediately to reduce the clicking/scrolling in a big way.
81
86%
Yes. I don't mind clicking/scrolling much more than I had to do in previous versions.
13
14%
 
Total votes : 94

Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby etl17 » Wed Jul 31, 2013 3:14 am

At 96%, I would expect that product management (and by extension product design folks) at Steinberg to be pretty upset at this point!
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Lydiot » Wed Jul 31, 2013 4:31 am

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Bernard Focquet » Wed Jul 31, 2013 8:39 am

I absolutely agree with the main concern of this poll.
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby etl17 » Wed Jul 31, 2013 5:31 pm

Bredo wrote:
etl17 wrote:At 96%, I would expect that product management (and by extension product design folks) at Steinberg to be pretty upset at this point!

This is a clear result. Nothing to be upset about, just get to work!

If it where 60/40 it would be upsetting. But it ain't.


Nicely said. This is what I meant to say. Sometimes the price for innovation is that you may have to try a couple of times before you get it right!
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Neutron Studios » Thu Aug 01, 2013 3:21 am

I can't comment on the CR as I use hardware for that.

I have to say though that I click much less with the new mixer.

For example I know that not being able to see the ins routing in the edit window next to the plugins involves some clicking, but seeing the group next to the channel, being able to jump between edit windows of groups and contained channels and inputs, being able to search for channels and being able to do all these things straight from the edit window is more important to me and saves me loads of time compared to N5. I don't have to switch views between the main mixer and the edit window to make changes to all the channels in a group for example. So for me the edit window is now more usable than it was before.
Do I miss the on/off function for plugins? Definitely Yes. Would I like to be able to customise the edit window view more? Maybe yes.

The main mixer window looks good (also to my clients) and is really functional in my opinion as well. It's highly customisable and all the shortcuts on top make life easier. The channel visibility and zones are very handy. I like the way I don't have to click to switch between inserts, meters, sends etc and all I have to do is simply scroll up and down with the mouse wheel and I can see and change everything on my channel. Copying plugins is brilliant.
I'd like the left/right channel scrolling to be faster though. Also the sizes of objects could be improved a bit.

It's a new way of working which took a bit of time to get used to but I definitely click less than N5 the more I adapt to it.
Maybe other people have a totally different way of working and do click more now than before.

I can't vote on this poll as it's basically asking "Do you want to click more or less" and it's taking for granted the fact that you click more on N6 mixer vs older versions. Of course everyone is going to answer they want to click less...
If it was something like "Do you think you click more on N6 mixer vs older versions - Yes/No" then the results would make more sense.
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Headlands » Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:56 am

Neutron -- I respect your viewpoint, thanks for posting.

The functions you mention are mostly great, and obviously need basic clicks/scrolls to use them (I don't think they require unnecessary clicking). However, the clicking and fiddling that was introduced to accomplish other things that needed far less clicking and fiddling before does not need to happen, as has been outlined on this forum and the Cubase forum in great detail by big numbers of users.

The poll has a post directly under it from me, which states: "The mixer has some great new features which are overshadowed by the large amounts of clicking and scrolling." To me this illustrates what many of us have been discussing here and on the Cubase forum for months. There is indeed no argument to be made in support for the increased amount of clicks for functions that required less on the old mixer design, and I have stated many times that I like the overall design of the mixer, apart from the largely needless clickfest.

It could have been worded more clearly, I suppose, but the massively large percentage of people who have voted for less clicking leads me to believe that almost all are on the same page, and Steinberg will know from looking at both forums what specifically is driving people nuts with the new mixer as far as clicking. The functions you refer to are new and generally do not require any excess clicking, so would not apply to what I'm polling about; Again, the poll probably could have been worded more clearly for some.

Not one person will complain when the mixer is made to be far less click-heavy with the functions that are currently unnecessarily so, I guarantee it. :)
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Big K » Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:11 pm

Hello Neutron Studios

May I ask in what line of audio business you are working?
This info might give me more understanding of the qualities of the N6 mixer thingy.

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Mark Ayres » Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:39 pm

The issue for me is that the mixer used to give me a clear overview of the mix - which is surely the entire point of it? This included plugin states. It took single mouse clicks to activate and deactivate plugins. Hover buttons are technically clever but a nightmare practically. and if these changes are to suit a hardware controller that (I suspect) a tiny proportion of users will buy (useless for me, for instance, recording and editing on the road), then the cart is surely before the horse. If necessary, give us a choice of two mixer window formats. That would please everyone.

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Neutron Studios » Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:51 pm

Hi Big K, I do mainly music production/recording/mixing with the occasional post work for TV and occasional mixing/surround mixing for music TV.

Hi Headlands,
I respect all your viewpoints as well and actually I agree with you for the most part on most points that you make here. And yes, of course I'll be happier with even less clicking :-)

I also have issues with the new mixer that I mentioned in my previous post. But I like this mixer much more than the old one and although I click more on some functions, I click much less to do other things which actually speeds up my work and I click less overall. That's why I mentioned the new functions and I believe they are relevant.
So overall, not function specific, if a project was taking me x amount of time to mix in N5, a similar project now takes me less time after having learnt and incorporated some of the new functions in my workflow. So I suppose I click less, haven't counted though :-)
Maybe I was using the N5 mixer in a non efficient way and the N6 fits more my style of working, I don't know.

As I said I like the new mixer design more and I would not like to see the old buttons back, at least not in the way they were in N5 as I believe they would clutter the interface and I like the current cleaner look. I'd like to see improvements that match the new design and not reverting back to the old design.
For example, I'd like to see the on/off function back to the plugins that I really miss, but not the old buttons as I think they would clutter the interface. Maybe command/ctrl+click to switch on/off and alt+click to bypass or something similar.

So Yes I would like things improved and less clicking for some problem functions and visibility improvements, but with changes that match the new design, but No I don't like more or would like to revert to the old N5 design as it was mentioned by some people in this thread as my workflow has actually improved with the new mixer.
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Headlands » Thu Aug 01, 2013 6:56 pm

Neutron,

I agree! I also do not want the old mixer back. What happens a lot with updates to software that has been around for years is that the crew who has been using for years can get up in arms with major changes. In this case the change to the overall mixer is fantastic, to me (and I've been using Cubendo for 11 years!) -- but they need, need, need to make it less click-y and more professional in the way we can see values, states, etc. Then it will live up to its potential.

I want the new design to stay, and am hoping that Steinberg will make the necessary changes to make it the beast that it truly has the potential to be. I went back to 5.5 a week ago for an older project that was being stubborn in 6, and it felt archaic in many ways. That being said... if changes are not made in the ways we're all talking about then I'll be moving on. I really do not want that to happen.
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Neutron Studios » Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:18 pm

I totally agree with you as well and I apologise for my long mumbling on my previous posts.
I only intervened as I felt that lots of people wanted the old mixer back to which I do not agree and had to express that opinion.
I am sure that yourself and other more experienced users than me can have a more constructive input to Steinberg as to what needs to be changed so that the workflow becomes even better, so although I'm happy overall, I hope to become even happier with the next update :)
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Headlands » Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:28 pm

Neutron Studios wrote:I totally agree with you as well and I apologise for my long mumbling on my previous posts.
I only intervened as I felt that lots of people wanted the old mixer back to which I do not agree and had to express that opinion.
I am sure that yourself and other more experienced users than me can have a more constructive input to Steinberg as to what needs to be changed so that the workflow becomes even better, so although I'm happy overall, I hope to become even happier with the next update :)


Yes: I agree completely. Wanting the old mixer back is pointless and useless because it's something that will never happen, and the new mixer design is a step forward in many ways. In my opinion Steinberg should absolutely not go back to the old mixer design completely, but instead make the new one as effective and professional to use as the old one, in key ways such as clicking and fiddling about! :)
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Dietz » Sat Aug 03, 2013 1:27 pm

.. the "old" design looks and feels fresher than the "new" one, though ... *sigh*
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Big K » Sat Aug 03, 2013 5:00 pm

My now 53 years old :shock: eyes tell me the same...
I still vote strongly for less clicks and less question marks.

This is probably the right mixer for the 96 kbit/s MP3, mono ( who needs 2 ears? )
energy drink hooked gaming generation.
But, hey, I won't be in the job in a 10 years time, anmyore,....I hope...
;-)

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby theoldman » Fri Aug 09, 2013 12:34 am

All is ok I heard a rumor that steinberg is going to give nuage to all the owners that are affected ( sorry own and have followed)the steinberg brand, the new nuage software interface,with hard ware adaption @ 20,000 e they will get it back with future sales of the nuage software interface, which rumore has it the name will be changed to, and I for one commend steinberg for there foresight and good marketing expertise. See and you where all doubting there motives, shame on you,ssssssss.

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Lydiot » Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:59 am

...
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Rickard » Sat Aug 10, 2013 2:46 pm

I hope that Steinberg pays attention to the conversation between Headlands and Neutron Studios. I am guessing that it reflects how most of us feel. Overall the new mixer is faster but I would love to see less clicking.

Yesterday, to save processing power, I wanted to turn off every plugin on a channel I wasn't going to use. Opening each plugin, clicking it off, closing it, opening the next one......slow and unnecessary. I hate now having to right click for a menu to invert eq gain. It used to be a button. I used to be able to click on a send and have the first effect of the fx channel would pop up. It doesn't have to be a trade off does it? Lets have the best of all worlds.

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Lydiot » Thu Sep 05, 2013 2:46 pm

...
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Bassman » Fri Sep 20, 2013 11:14 pm

Today I've open a old project in N5.5 and I was happy. The new N6 Mixer looks tidier maybe and the controlroom part with meters are good and easy to manage, but this hover things make me total nervous and it's tiring. Yes please, give us the Buttons back! There is so much free space for this. And for the channelstrip ... it sounds nice, but its difficult to set it right with these small buttons, so I use only Tapesat. BTW, I don't need a scalable mixer, because with every change in dimensions, I have to search the things new with my mouse. My mixer is on my secound monitor, with always the same dimensions, so I hit the buttons in N5 mixer almost blind. I'll begin my next project in N5.5 again.
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Lydiot » Mon Oct 21, 2013 7:40 pm

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Lydiot » Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:51 pm

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Lydiot » Mon Oct 28, 2013 4:23 pm

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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Bifop » Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:44 pm

Man you're really becoming annoying...
Why all the hate ?
It seems you don't even realize how you come across.

To the subject of this poll and your control room crusade :
I don't mind clicking more, I don't find the mixer unworkable.
I have lots of work that I achieve in Nuendo 6 daily.
I voted 2.
I open two control rooms if I need to see meters and destinations.
I don't wish you to get banned.
Keep your private warnings well... private if they've been sent privately or else, what is your goal ? That we stand up for you ?
Jake68, get out of Lydiot now !
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Phonetical » Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:59 pm

^Agree with this.
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Re: POLL: Clicking and fiddling in the new mixer.

Postby Lydiot » Mon Oct 28, 2013 7:15 pm

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