[ISSUES] VST performance related

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Re: [ISSUES] VST performance related

Postby Asgardao » Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:54 pm

Arijalmari wrote:Funny thing is I get the real time spikes on a relatively light project by clicking anywhere on the empty area in the arrangement window... :shock: I'm a hobbyist, so no loss of income luckily for me.

Have you tried what I posted couple of days ago? -> viewtopic.php?f=175&t=34764
Cubase 7.0.2 64bit, Win 7
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[ISSUE] Cubase 7, really bad vst performance.

Postby DigitalGate » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:18 am

Im having a Cubase 7 issue:
My vst performance peaks when i add alot of instruments, this happens even with just a couple of instruments,
especially "real-time peak", producing alot of static, lag and "studders"
(I dont mean lag, as in time-delay, but more like a overloading issue, like listening to a radio channel, not tuned in perfectly, with some small timestudders mixxed in)

The computer I use is in my opinion up to date for sound, 64bit and win 7 with loads of ram, wich in theory should support several instruments, so I dont think its a hardware issue.
I'm starting to lean towards a soundcard or vst driver issue! When i change asio driver to directx fullduplex or asio4all, the vst peaks seem to go down a tad, but not dissappear completely
I have innstalled the latest version of both the driver of the soundcard and Cubase 7.

Any Ideas?


Computer specs:
Cpu: Intel(R) Core(TM) i5 CPU, 750 @ 2.67 GHz
Ram: 8 BG ram
Operating system: Windows 7 Home Premium, SP1 (64 bit)
Soundcard: M-Audio FW Solo
Hard drive: ST3500320AS ATA DEVICE (500 GB)
GPU: AMD Radeon HD 6800
Motherboard: P7P55D DELUXE (ASUSTeK Computer INC.)
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Cubase 7 VST Performance

Postby Said Saba » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:19 am

So, I am mixing an album on my laptop, session is about 100 Tracks 88.2/24 Bits.
I couldn't daisy chain my External Hard drive with my Audio interface because the Disk Cache Load bar was complete full and Audio wont play. I had to copy the session into my desktop and it finally worked.

Until i decided to upgrade to a SSD just for OS and Apps and have the 7200 Drive for Data and Audio.

Now my Average Load Bar and real time peak are always full, making cubase unusable!! Even with an empty sesion, real time peak goes to 15%

i dont think this SSD upgrade will be the cause, since i am now using a dedicated drive for audio and a dedicated drive for apps, this should work even better than before!

i've heard people having problems with the performance too, is there any way i could solve this? going back to a spinner drive is not an option, my system boots in 15 seconds!

Specs:

MBP 3.06 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
8 HB 1067 MHz DDR3
128 GB Crucial M4 SSD
500 GB 7200 Rpm HD (Seagate)
Motu Traveler MKI Audio Interface (FW400-800)

Hope you guys can help!!
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Re: [ISSUE] Cubase 7, really bad vst performance.

Postby grpetz » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:07 am

It is a known issue with Cubase 7. I use the Steinberg ur824 interface and I have compared it with a tascaam us1800 and both have issues with real time peak. I have had to use Ableton Live BETA 8 for the vst instruments. It can handle vsts in great amounts. I am hoping the next maintenance release of Cubase 7 will solve this issue.

When I disabled my factory built in audio card in windows the peaks seemed to slow down and not be as much but I still had major problems running vsti's at 128 buffer setting....I am running Win i7 with 16gb of ram and 7200 rpm drives.

Gary
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Re: Cubase 7 VST Performance

Postby BriHar » Tue Feb 19, 2013 1:51 pm

Have you checked the SSD installation? I know there are some issues that need to be checked which are not particularly obvious unless measured, but which can have serious consequences if wrong. One important check I seem to recall is the start sector offset., also garbage collection and trim settings.
This site has some good information: http://thessdreview.com/
...yes I think it can be easily done, just take everything down to Highway 61.

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Cubase 7.5.30 - 64bit | Cubase AI7 | WaveLab 8 - 64bit | PT10 | UR28M | UR44 | CMC-PD/4xFD/QC/AI/CH/TP | BCF2000 | Shuttlexpress | Graphire Tablet | Cubendo Custom Keyboard | Lenovo E31 Workstation:Xeon E3-1225V2/3.2GHz; 8GB DDR3 SDRAM; 2x Intel-Flash520 SSD 180GB (C:/D:);1TB 7200rpm Sata3 (F:); DVD RW (E:); Ext. 3TB USB3 Freecom + WD 1TB; Nvidea GeForce GT 630 4GB DDR3 Video Ram AGP PCIE | Win 7 Pro 64 Bit
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Re: VST performance issues

Postby Mikael » Tue Feb 19, 2013 9:12 pm

The 7.0.2 update solved our most urgent concern with C7 - the poor ASIO Performance compared to 6.5.3 which I reported a while ago in this tread. Thank you. 7.0.2 performs adequate or even slightly better now with our super-loaded low-latency live systems.

Another improvement is a change in the EUCON Adapter. The Cubase mixer view used to change every time I used the Knob Set Selectors on my Avid McMix Consoles. This was very annoying. Now the Cubase mixer view doesn't Change anymore when I use Knob Set Selectors of the consoles.

I am very pleased, thank you.

Mikael wrote:I am runnning a heavily loaded Project for live performance with approximately 15 recorded audio tracks, 58 tracks in total, lots of plugins, on a very fast dual Xeon system with very low ASIO buffer size of 64 samples with rme audio hardware.

In Cubase 6.5, this project runs rock solid, at the performance limit of the system yet I never have any ASIO meter reds and never any crackles.

With C 7.0.1, I get reds in the ASIO meter quickly, and occasional crackles, and sometimes (rarely) I get a burst of crackles. Although cpu load (in the Task Manager) is a bit lower in C7 compared to C6.5, ASIO performance is worse in C7.0.1

I even get occasional ASIO spikes and the red light going on when the project is stopped and ASIO Performance drops down to 45%.

I like the many improvements of C7. However, for me, good and reliable ASIO Performance is the single most important thing, and C7 has an issue here.

Fixing this issue is, for me, most important.

Regards, Mikael

P.S.: EDIT:
Tested this issue under W7/64 and W8/64, it's the same on either operating System.
SW: C 7.5.10 /64 & Wavelab 8 on W7/64 & W8/64
HW: 2 x Dell Precision T5500 Xeon 12-core workstations
Audio: 4 x rme HDSPe / Multiface II, 3 x Octamic II
Surface: 3 x Avid MC Mix, 1 x MC Transport
Plugins: Audioease, Lexicon, Neve Portico, Yamaha Vintage, SlateDigital, Izotope
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Re: Cubase 7 VST Performance

Postby Said Saba » Wed Feb 20, 2013 5:55 am

YEAH!

I figured that out and switch the Drives, it is know working perfectly! thanks for the link!
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Re: [ISSUE] Cubase 7, really bad vst performance.

Postby richardjay » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:31 pm

You say it's a known issue, but is it something that Steinberg have actually acknowledged ?
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Re: [ISSUE] Cubase 7, really bad vst performance.

Postby N8 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:36 pm

IEEE 1394 chipset brand?
W7 64bit, XP SP3,LE1/ LE4/SX3/ C4/ C6.5/ C7.0.2 64bit, CI1, Firebox

Gob-smacked at the number of contestants for Dwarf #7.

If the sum total of IQs on this forum were applied to lightbulb wattage, it would create a black hole.
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Re: Cubase 7 VST Performance

Postby babaorum » Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:27 pm

What do you have exactly do ?
Cubase 7.5.10 64bits- Windows 8.1 pro 64bits - wavelab element 8.0.3 - core i7 920 - 12 Go RAM - 250 Go SSD + 32 Go SSD + 4.750 To HDD. Creamware/Sonic Core Luna + Pulsar II.
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Re: [ISSUE] Cubase 7, really bad vst performance.

Postby DigitalGate » Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:44 am

I dont know much about chipsets, but the whole computer should supports a 64bit system, as thats what it was built for.

reading the specifications of my motherboard, P7P55D Deluxe, it says:
chipset: Intel® P55 Express Chipset
IEEE 1394: VIA® 6308P controller supports 2 x 1394a port(s) (one at mid-board; one at back panel)

Maby the problem lies with using 32bit vst instruments in a 64bit environment, and the vstbridge it creates.
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Re: [ISSUE] Cubase 7, really bad vst performance.

Postby Mikael » Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:59 am

Did you try out the new 7.0.2 release? This solved the ASIO Performance issue for me.
SW: C 7.5.10 /64 & Wavelab 8 on W7/64 & W8/64
HW: 2 x Dell Precision T5500 Xeon 12-core workstations
Audio: 4 x rme HDSPe / Multiface II, 3 x Octamic II
Surface: 3 x Avid MC Mix, 1 x MC Transport
Plugins: Audioease, Lexicon, Neve Portico, Yamaha Vintage, SlateDigital, Izotope
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Re: [ISSUE] Cubase 7, really bad vst performance.

Postby DigitalGate » Thu Feb 21, 2013 10:01 am

I tried the 7.0.2 patch yes, but i'm still experiencing the same issues with vst performance.
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Re: [ISSUES] VST performance related

Postby gianni » Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:33 pm

DigitalGate wrote:I tried the 7.0.2 patch yes, but i'm still experiencing the same issues with vst performance.


Same here with 7.0.2, real time peak meter spikes after a while when working on a project.
INTEL i7-950; ASUS P6T Deluxe v.2; Corsair 12GB; ASUS EAH4350 SILENT/DI/512MD2(LP); WIN 7 64 bit PRO; RME HDSP 9652
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Re: [ISSUES] VST performance related

Postby gmmccurdy » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:18 pm

gianni wrote:
DigitalGate wrote:I tried the 7.0.2 patch yes, but i'm still experiencing the same issues with vst performance.


Same here with 7.0.2, real time peak meter spikes after a while when working on a project.




So this is happening with Windows users as well. Steinberg started a poll/thread to determine how many Mac users were having this issue but it looks like it should be expanded to Windows users as well.
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================================
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Re: [ISSUES] VST performance related

Postby gmmccurdy » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:20 pm

You should visit this thread and chime in how it's not just Mac users.


https://www.steinberg.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=175&t=34772
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Re: [ISSUES] VST performance related

Postby DigitalGate » Thu Feb 21, 2013 5:53 pm

updated the eLLC, still having the same vst issue as before. Its getting frustrating.
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Re: Cubase 7 VST Performance

Postby Said Saba » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:17 pm

babaorum wrote:What do you have exactly do ?


i changed the position of the hard drives

the SSD went into the optibay, and the HD into its original place

i also activate TRIM support for the SSD
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Re: Performance Issues

Postby 7blackknights » Sun Mar 03, 2013 7:14 am

absolutely right ! steinberg support couldn't resolve this pb : where is the bottleneck that prevents me to be at ease with my I7 6 cores 4.ghz / 20 gb 1600 Ram/ 2 ssd 256 gb and a few tb's? They keep on coming with the same tips - high latency/7200 rpm disks different than the system/ disable ht etc... nothing to explain where is the pb with w7 ! sad really ;) I guess they just don't know
Win 7 64 - C7 64 7.0.2 - I7 3970X - 20Gb DDR 3 1600 - Asus Rampage extreme IV - SSD x2 + back up 7200 HD's - Steinberg Mr 816 X FW - 44.1/24 bits -
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Re: Performance Issues

Postby promotouk » Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:39 pm

Have the same issue with just the blank window of 7 open the asio real time peak is banging to half way all the time its like a constant pulse. I am not using 7 at the mo as it is way to unstable I have gone back to 6.5 until they sort out all these issues
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Re: Performance Issues

Postby Tarmac » Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:25 am

All

Just thought I would post my findings after suffering a couple of issues similar to above. I originally wrote this post after problems with Cubase 7.

viewtopic.php?f=175&t=35933

Turns out that if I left it long enough Cubase would open the project although some were taking more than 10 minutes!! Once I managed to get projects open I realised I had the problem described in this post. Cubase 7 was unusable with clicking, popping and dropping out. Performance meter peaking a lot and consistently hovering around 25%.

I have now disabled Asioguard and both my problems have disappeared although the average performance meter still hovers around 25% and I get a very occasional peak. Question is whether there is an underlying problem that switching off Asioguard just helps to contain (or not in some cases)!
HP Pavillion Laptop
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Re: Performance Issues

Postby Elektrobolt » Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:29 am

7blackknights wrote:absolutely right ! steinberg support couldn't resolve this pb : where is the bottleneck that prevents me to be at ease with my I7 6 cores 4.ghz / 20 gb 1600 Ram/ 2 ssd 256 gb and a few tb's? They keep on coming with the same tips - high latency/7200 rpm disks different than the system/ disable ht etc... nothing to explain where is the pb with w7 ! sad really ;) I guess they just don't know

Yet my system, with a quad i7, less RAM, RAID drives (TB sizes) with HT enabled, etc., works great. I use Windows 8, Cubase 7, MR816, CC121, various plugins, etc. (As much 64-bit as possible.)

:) I guess we just do not know either.
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Re: [ISSUES] VST performance related

Postby MikeVee » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:38 pm

I thought I would add my experience to this thread and I THINK I may have gotten it resolved.

i7 980X
16GB Ram
Windows 7 64 bit
Cubase 7.0.3 32 bit
LynxTWO-C PCI sound card

I had been running Cubase 6.5.3 with ASTOUNDING SPEED and never, ever a click or pop - all at 24/96 and 32 sometimes 64 buffer, tons of plugs, tons of midi, etc. All my CPU bios settings were on default and my windows was never really optimized, had Aero on and all kinds of graphic effects, it never mattered. CPU was overclocked and running super smooth and cool, EASILY running 32 buffer at 96K - latency was .66ms or something stupid crazy fast. It was stable like this for as long as I could remember.

Then SECOND I upgraded to 6.5.4 and made NO OTHER changes, everything changed. I could barely run 128 without clicks and really to make them NEVER happen I had to go to 512. When I tried to go back to 6.5.3 it didn;t matter.

So I figured maybe this new ASIO guard thing in 7 would help so I paid the 150 and upgraded. Same thing except now the "real time" meter spikes like crazy!! SO I tried every single optimization I could find and nothing helped. 7.0.3 update did not help.

Finally today I got my buffer back to 64. Here is what I THINK did it:

- disable ASIO guard
- disable and uninstall anything related to overclocking
- turn on the Steinberg Power Scheme
- go into bios and disable all the power saving things for the CPU
- disable hyperthreading

Now NONE of this mattered on 6.5.3 but for some reason it does on later versions. So now even though i am at 64 buffer, I still can't get to 32 and I can't run my system as fast as I used to, but I am "happy" to at least have it sort of resolved, even though my CPU is running hotter on the SB power theme yet it;s not going as fast. Cubase 7 still seems less stable though and it does crash here and there. The graphics are buggy as hell.

They NEED to see what changed after 6.5.3 because that is what KILLED Cubase in my opinion!!!!!
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Re: [ISSUES] VST performance related

Postby Michalis.M » Wed Mar 27, 2013 3:57 pm

Hi All

It seems that 7.0.3 has just been released which i have just downloaded and going to try tonight.

the question is : HAS IT SOLVED THE PERFORMANCE / SPIKING ISSUE?

Has anyone tried it yet?
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Re: [ISSUES] VST performance related

Postby gianni » Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:35 pm

Michalis.M wrote:Hi All

It seems that 7.0.3 has just been released which i have just downloaded and going to try tonight.

the question is : HAS IT SOLVED THE PERFORMANCE / SPIKING ISSUE?

Has anyone tried it yet?


Not solved (for me) on Windows 7 64 bit with the 7.0.3 update.

The situation is the same: real time peak meter spikes after a while when working on a project.


Edit: maybe THE PROBLEM IS SOLVED.

After contacting the support team (they told me to disable ASIO Guard and to activate the High Performance Power scheme in the Windows Control Panel, but unfortunately everything was already in place) I tried to activate the Steinberg Audio Power Scheme in Device Setup, and the spikes are gone.

At the moment I just tried one song in Cubase 32 bit where I had spikes, but the change is evident: Power Scheme on = no spikes, Power Scheme off = a lot of real time peak meter spikes.

In Cubase 7.0.0/.1/.2 the Steinberg Audio Power Scheme had no effect on performance.
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