[New song] I can never let you go

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[New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:55 pm

Hi..After mucho bollokino from Jonathan regarding the proper use of strings I've bitten the bullet and had a good go at em on this song, I thank him for taking the time to always point out the problems and offer solutions...also gotta thank twilight song for bringing levels into the mix on my last song..must admit, never really looked at levels much but I did on this track...

If you have the time to listen..thank you..............Kevin

https://soundcloud.com/knmac/i-can-never-let-you-go
Last edited by shadowfax on Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Bane » Sun Nov 24, 2013 11:05 pm

Hey another nice one. I particularly like the section around 1.59 to 2.18 with the bass and piano, though I feel the bass gets a bit high in the section afterwards (according to my monitors anyway). Thanks for sharing. ;)
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:11 pm

Hi Bane..just reupped it with a little less bass.....Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Bane » Mon Nov 25, 2013 5:07 pm

Keeping in mind that I don't have the previous version for reference, I do believe this one is a little more balanced in that spot. But I'm guessing you are going for a more low-end heavy song? Normally I tend to bury the bass a bit more in pop/rock, but that's just me.

BTW, what monitors did you mix this one on?
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:30 pm

The monitors I mixed on are the ones in my sig..tried the Adams but just didn't get on with em..much prefer the Genelecs and the build quality is far superior to the Adams which in my case left a lot to be desired...wasn't goin for any particular kind of song..just trying to get a mix right..constant struggle....cheers, Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Sherz » Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:38 pm

Always a fan of your songs and vocal, and the core ideas in this one certainly don't disappoint! :D

Structurally speaking I'm not convinced.... you know me! :D
It's quite a long wait to get to the meat of the song and meanders too much I reckon. And I think in this day and age of instant gratification it would work better - certainly dynamically, to have those earlier choruses "I can Never Let You Go" much bigger, i.e. full arrangement, then collapse back down into a more open stripped-back verse. Generally I think you could edit this down to under 4 minutes, create more highs and lows, at the moment it feels a bit flat and too "bitsy" - and the verse/chorus/bridge etc are not so well-defined. I'd lose the interlude at 1:54 - 2:17.

Fundamentally It's a really good song that for me currently has a lot of untapped potential. I really think there's a more optimal structure to be had, one with a more commercial pop-song sensibility. Now I realise that may not be what you want but for me, this like many of your tunes has commercial pop written all over it albeit a somewhat 80's vibe, which of course largely comes down to arrangement/production choices etc.

In fact you're a very good writer, you regularly come up with some real catchy, hooky lines which I often envy, and a voice that is pleasing to the ear. It's another one of those songs that when I hear it I think 'I'd love to get my hands on this!"

8-)

Anyway, as always, take or leave anything I say! Still a fan... and if you ever want to chance me having another crack at "Sherzifying" one of your tunes, just let me know. ;)
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Thu Nov 28, 2013 1:27 pm

Hi, You can sherzify anything you want, I'm not precious about the songs...thanks for the comments..I am aware that my production skills let my songs down but, hey..it's only a hobby.

cheers, Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby kzarider » Sun Dec 01, 2013 1:31 am

I hate instant gratification lol...foreplay is great. I really like the part without the drums better,but, it would sound great with a real drummer instead

The mix is very dark and I think it works but could be remastered...It does sound a little bit like two different production styles but the song is great.
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Sun Dec 01, 2013 10:30 am

struggled with it production wise..same as with all my attempts at songs...Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby kzarider » Sun Dec 01, 2013 6:43 pm

shadowfax wrote:struggled with it production wise..same as with all my attempts at songs...Kevin

I hope you don't mind me saying this (doesn't matter I am going to anyway lol)

You are an incredible writer and artist and it is good to be humble...but...If you can find a couple of great players that you can collaborate with (not mediocre players 'GREAT' players who will tell you exactly how they feel whether you agree or not, if you have to save your money to this, it would be worth it!) and allow them to input their hearts into your music you could truly have a master piece collection of tunes. Come to Nashville I will hook you up :)
That said this is really good stuff
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Jonathan5456 » Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:48 pm

The strings sound much better than before in the fact that they now fill up the frequencies better from low to high and left to right. But now my criticism is that they don't play anything that interesting. So the next steps are to try and give the string parts some partial 'answering' melodic phrases to the vocal melody. The 2nd violin area (just left of center) sounds a bit thin or low in comparison to 1st violins (far left.) Lastly the dynamics don't really go anywhere, but once you begin writing partial counter-melody lines then that should start to happen more naturally. Overall it sounds far fuller than previous stuff with strings but they need to move in terms of notes more, just takes practice though so keep at it.

The 3rd chord of the progression doesn't sound quite right to me, maybe it's just the bass note or the other notes of the chord. But it doesn't give it as powerful an emotional impact as it could (and should imo.) I'm not at the piano so I can't really say why, I just know that the notes don't sound that strong vertically following from the previous chord. The delay gives it a nice rhythm though. You're improving all the time though so you should be proud of that.
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:50 pm

Thanks Jonathan..mainly down to you that my string arrangement has improved, did attempt to have more melody goin on put seemed to always be fighting with the vox...got a lot to learn yet and might buy EWQL gold strings over the next coupla weeks..

Kenny...your words are very encouraging and I thank you for you amazing offer, If I'm ever in the postion to follow up I will be in touch..this is just a hobby and I have no thoughts of any success in the music industry, got more chance of winning the lottery...which I don't actually do!!!

best to you both...Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby iqi616 » Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:13 pm

Overall I like this but was concerned that the attack of the first guitar note is missing, there's a funny little fade-up instead. It needs to be one thing or the other. Either a long slow fade-in or a proper start to the first note.

I'd put a drop in at 2:18 to let things hang in the air for a moment and then bring in the louder section. I'd like the louder section to be louder and more intense. Really I'd like to hear more changes in dynamics between the different sections of the piece.

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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:11 am

iqi616 wrote:Overall I like this but was concerned that the attack of the first guitar note is missing, there's a funny little fade-up instead. It needs to be one thing or the other. Either a long slow fade-in or a proper start to the first note.

I'd put a drop in at 2:18 to let things hang in the air for a moment and then bring in the louder section. I'd like the louder section to be louder and more intense. Really I'd like to hear more changes in dynamics between the different sections of the piece.

...Mike.


Thanks for the comments Mike.. the first note went missing somewhere between getting it off Cubase and on to Soundcloud, certainly my fault but dunno how..havent had time to replace it yet....got probs making things "louder and more intense" last time I did it I had too much distortion...oh well, Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Early21 » Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:27 am

Kevin, I really like this one. Stretching yourself a bit! The strings and guitar are working for me in the beginning, but let the expert (Jonathan) continue to help you, it's working! Love the transition introduced by the piano. It's a sonic break that gives variety. Also nice to read everybody's helpful comments. I agree with Kenny, the drums are a little bit of a weakness. But this song is a step up in my opinion.
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Thu Dec 12, 2013 12:21 pm

Thanks early....It's aways hard to get what's in my head into (then out of) the box...never sounds as it should!!!Jonathan has definately pushed me towards better strings which is now a rod for my own back because whatever I do now that includes strings has to be at least as good as this...glad of it !!!..comments from everyone have helped me improve but ...long way to go..hate programming drums, cheers, Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby JSW » Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:43 pm

Well Done really like your work Kevin. I have no advice for you on this, but wanted to let you know (carryover from studio pic thread) your sound translates great into my little room.
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Thu Dec 12, 2013 5:49 pm

thank you John...I apreciate you taking the time to listen and comment...Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Bane » Sat Dec 14, 2013 7:05 pm

Out of curiosity, did you use Jamstix on any of this or was it all programmed from scratch?
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Sat Dec 14, 2013 7:45 pm

I just played this on my keyboard...that's why it's rubbish...Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Bane » Sat Dec 14, 2013 7:55 pm

Could have done with a bit more variation but otherwise, I didn't think it was that bad actually.
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Sat Dec 14, 2013 8:07 pm

thats why I'm trying to get into Jamstix more..it's quite brilliant when you get your head around it and thanks to ralph at Rayzoon it seems to finally fixed...Kevin
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Sherz » Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:32 am

kzarider wrote:
shadowfax wrote:struggled with it production wise..same as with all my attempts at songs...Kevin

I hope you don't mind me saying this (doesn't matter I am going to anyway lol)

You are an incredible writer and artist and it is good to be humble...but...If you can find a couple of great players that you can collaborate with (not mediocre players 'GREAT' players who will tell you exactly how they feel whether you agree or not, if you have to save your money to this, it would be worth it!) and allow them to input their hearts into your music you could truly have a master piece collection of tunes. Come to Nashville I will hook you up :)
That said this is really good stuff


I concur completely. Kevin really does write very appealing and memorable songs.... ones that really do beg and deserve a professional touch. And that's not to say that the mixes produced are not palatable in anyway, as they certainly convey, very effectively, the essential essence of the song. And when I listen to his material I most often find myself superimposing different arrangements, production etc etc on them.

So, if there was a way that this forum could gather together in a collaborative sense, and take onboard one of Kev's tunes, with the intent of making it the best it could be, with the resources we have at hand... how might that happen I wonder?
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby Sherz » Sun Dec 15, 2013 8:37 am

shadowfax wrote:thats why I'm trying to get into Jamstix more..it's quite brilliant when you get your head around it and thanks to ralph at Rayzoon it seems to finally fixed...Kevin


While there is no substitute for the real thing... Jamstix is probably the next best thing... but it does take time to master... I've been at it for a couple of years, and I feel like I'm just a beginner...
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Re: [New song] I can never let you go

Postby shadowfax » Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:03 am

Sherz wrote:
shadowfax wrote:thats why I'm trying to get into Jamstix more..it's quite brilliant when you get your head around it and thanks to ralph at Rayzoon it seems to finally fixed...Kevin


While there is no substitute for the real thing... Jamstix is probably the next best thing... but it does take time to master... I've been at it for a couple of years, and I feel like I'm just a beginner...



Yeah it is awesome and needs time to fully realise it's potential, I intend to make it my only drummer from now on...just hate trawling through midi files looking for the right drum bit..end up just putting anyhting there cause can never find what I think should be there......Kevin
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