Simple Question On VST System Link

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Simple Question On VST System Link

Postby grpetz » Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:22 pm

I am currently using a Steinberg UR824 with Cubase 7. Our live set uses a lot of VST instruments and to compensate for any potential ASIO overloads during the live recording I usually up the buffer size if there is a lot of the VST instruments to be used at the same time, however that does not help the vocal audio channels in a live setup as then there is the longer delay on the vocals through the system.

Question is... Can I setup a 2nd computer to use with VST system link for running the VST instruments and this 2nd computer using its own usb audio interface to run those sounds? This way I can lower the latency (buffer size) on the main recording computer running the vocals and keys, and up the buffer size on the remote computer.

Thank you for helping. Gary
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Re: Simple Question On VST System Link

Postby grpetz » Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:15 am

Thanks Steve for the detailed reply. Your simple setup would probably work for me, except I need the ability to edit any midi notes out individually during the mix downs after our live sets and not just record the ouput of the 2nd computers VST to an audio track on the 1st. Is it possible to sync the 2nd computer with the 1st during mixdown to replay exactly as it was recorded live? If so, then this may be the solution.

As a work around I thought I would use the direct monitoring function with the UR824 and up my buffer to about 512 samples, however using direct monitoring voids any inserts or send effects that can be produced on those channels and I use a VST looper to loop incoming audio on some channels from keyboards, and I also need the option to add delay to vocal tracks when needed. Using the direct monitoring does work great to guarantee no dropouts. The compromise I have found is to not use direct monitoring and adjust my machine to about 192 samples and have a small but noticeable delay. For live purposes this delay is not so bad in the monitors, but if you put on the headphones and sing with those it can be noticed a lot more.

In my experiments I have found that Ableton Live 8 (Beta 64bit version) and Reaper could handle MUCH lower buffer samples and provide no ASIO dropouts, even as far as going to the lowest setting of buffer size for least amount of latency. However those two software pieces do not have the full abilities of midi editing and some audio features that I have found with Cubase, nor the quality. At any time our live sets could use up to 7 VST instruments at one time, mostly Halion Orchestra and other Halion 4 instruments. I am running an ASUS Laptop G74 with 16gb of ram and I use the 2nd internal hard drive to store the VST sound banks. At this point I've done all that I can think of for now... but I will keep trying until I succeed with what I desire. Lowest latency possible with no dropouts.

Thanks again and I appreciate your taking the time to respond. Gary
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Re: Simple Question On VST System Link

Postby grpetz » Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:59 pm

As I mentioned, with my set up, it's basically the same method as using any other ordinary outboard midi instrument/device ... keyboard, sound module etc. Same type of generalalities associated with midi outboard gear apply...though there are more possibilites with using a 2nd computer loaded with VSTi's than with a midi keyboard or sound module.


So in the setup that I am using, I have a Tascaam US144 for my midi input for the VST tracks. It has a midi out option of course, so can I just choose this as an output on my midi tracks in Cubase which would then send out through the Tascaam to the 2nd computer for the VSTi? and then from the 2nd computer return the audio to the UR824? Am I understanding this right? Thank you.

Gary
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Re: Simple Question On VST System Link

Postby grpetz » Thu Jan 31, 2013 8:36 am

Well that solves a lot to use two computers, one for the VSTi load and the other for the audio load... however I may need to transfer my Halion 4 license over to another dongle or just purchase another Halion for the 2nd machine. Appreciate your help and suggestions. Gary
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Re: Simple Question On VST System Link

Postby grpetz » Sun Feb 03, 2013 7:03 pm

Found what looks to be a great solution rather than VST system link or even midi cables... it is called FX-Teleport and very affordable with good reviews from producers. I'd rather use this than to by additional sound cards and jump through the other loops... Gary

http://www.fx-max.com/fxt/product.html

I found this FX-Teleport from this writeup about VST system link

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jan12/articles/qand1-0112-5.htm
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Re: Simple Question On VST System Link

Postby grpetz » Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:09 pm

Hi Steve. Well I decided not to go with FX-Teleport as it appears support for it and the development of it with support is not there. For now I have went with using rtpMidi to communicate to my second computer sending the midi for VST instrument purposes using Ableton Live Beta 8 64bit, it processes VST instruments much smoother than Cubase 7 at this time without pops and asio overloads for the intensity of real time live playing and what we do. So in summary I am using Cubase 7 for recording the audio on the 1st computer and the 2nd computer using Ableton for the midi VSTi's...

Gary
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Re: Simple Question On VST System Link

Postby grpetz » Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:48 pm

Yes, on the 2nd computer I use a Tascaam US1800 to process the VSTi's and return the audio output to the 1st computer using the Steinberg UR824. rtpMidi does only transmit the midi and it does require additional audio cards to be on those computers it sends to. The ultimate solution will be moving towards the Vienna Pro setup as it does not require the sound cards and contains current support for both windows or a mac version setup.

At this point I have tested and run successfully about 50 channels of midi being sent via my wifi router through rtpmidi. I have all my midi keyboards and controllers plugged into the first computer, and the 2nd receives from the first through rtpMidi.


To make it real simple, for me, the first computer I called the session was something like this: MasterSend1, and then on the 2nd computer I called the session Receive1, and then connected those two sessions via the rtpMidi. Each session I have found can broadcast up to the normal 16 channels of midi and be received on the 2nd computer by adjusting the appropriate session and midi channel to match it.

I did have a few problems with running rtpMidi on a Windows 7 I3 laptop, only about 4 yrs old, it dropped midi notes occasionally when using it to run Cubase 7 and send the midi through rtpMidi. I have access to a an older macbook pro, about 5 yrs old, and it worked perfect to run Cubase 7 and send the midi to the 2nd computer running windows 7 with a core I7 setup.

In discussing the original topic I have discovered the VST system link has it weak points as it requires additional digital audio cards that can transmit. The Vienna Pro will beat it all around as it can network without additional cards. Too bad Cubase has not changed their system as it could easily bring more people into their DAW setup.

Gary

Gary
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