Translating Clipgain from PT10?

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Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Mon Apr 23, 2012 4:20 pm

Hi

Has anybody already figured out a AAF-setting, which allows me to convert PT10-clipgain to Nuendo-clipgain?
And is there in between a way to translate fades and stereofiles to Nuendo using AAF?

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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Kid Dropper Sound » Mon Apr 23, 2012 5:04 pm

Clip gain from PT to N5 will only translate when it's with +12db or less. If the PT clip gain level is above that, it will render a new audiofile and reset the clip gain to zero. No special settings, though I to check "import all media" in the nuendo import dialog.

For clips that are over +12db ( and it's a super pain in the ass to find them, so just don't do it) You can move them to a new track, the lower all of them by a uniform amount, like 20db or something. then +20 them when you get to nuendo and move them back in to place.

I don't know of a way to get interleved stereo files out of either. I keep that box unchecked in PT for now since it's not compatible with lower versions of PT either.
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Mon Apr 23, 2012 5:31 pm

Hey Jesse,
would you please give me your settings in PT-AAF-export? I just do not get any clipgain transfered to nuendo...
Or is this a cpt-only kind of thing?
Thank you a lot,
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Kid Dropper Sound » Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:21 pm

I'm not actually making any setting. I'm just File/export/selected tracks to AAF. Whatever the default is, it works.

It could be a cptk thing. but I really doubt it
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Kid Dropper Sound » Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:24 pm

I have not tried doing it with clip gain automation.. only static clip gain levels. I know the two programs treat the gain automation differently, maybe that's it?

Coalesce clip gain to automation when all else fails.
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:59 am

Ah, thank you very much!
When I do no settings, consolidate files and leave the avid-compatibility-box checked (unfortunately all cuts are slipped to frame grid now), the clipgain is transmitted as you described!
...But in this case the standard (vol-)automation is dropped here.
So do I have to export two AAFs - one for translating clipgain and one for automation data - and then replace the clips to get clipgain and automation data transfered...?
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby neilwilkes » Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:13 pm

The best way to get stuff out of PT10 is to use the PTF format (it is still there, right?) and translate to S-XML using AA Translator. You'll get a lot more information carried across.
AA Translator also ships with a spreadsheet telling you what each standard can do from each application both original & destination.
Well worth having.
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:55 am

Yeah, I already had a look at aatranslator. Seems to be a proper software in between. Two or three years ago, there was max PT5-support, so I bought the SSL-Pro Convert, which was - I have to admit - the biggest software-flop I ever invested in, since there was no single update until today, and they took 500 Bucks for this.... Coming from a pro-company like SSL, it is really a shame!

Problem with aatranslator at the moment seems to be, that if I save as a .ptf in PT, my clipgain is lost. And so clipgain cannot be translated, thats why I still have to use AAF for this.
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:48 am

I just purchased the aatranslator, saved my pro tools session as ptf7-9, translated to steinberg xml, but there are no x-fades translated?!! Can this be? Due to aatranslators spread sheet, x-fades are supported?
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby neilwilkes » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:02 am

Domilik wrote:I just purchased the aatranslator, saved my pro tools session as ptf7-9, translated to steinberg xml, but there are no x-fades translated?!! Can this be? Due to aatranslators spread sheet, x-fades are supported?


What version of AAT do you have?
It does indeed say in the v5.3 Spreadsheet that these should be translated.
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:13 am

Got the latest version...
I just also contacted official support, which responded immediately, and is checking my files at the moment. Great service!
I keep you informed!
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby John Lundsten » Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:09 pm

Domilik wrote:Got the latest version...
I just also contacted official support, which responded immediately, and is checking my files at the moment. Great service!
I keep you informed!

As the guy who constructed the spreadsheet and does loads of the testing I confirm that yes indeed X-fades from ptf do translate across to Steinberg Track Archive, (what we call S-xml).
Thing is ptf exported from PT10, whilst generally like Vers 9 ptf do seem exhibit some variations.

Hard to know if this is down to development / changes between PT10 updates or less likely IMO the new options in the PT 'Save Session Copy' dialogue are critical.

Anyway thanks Domilik, the more real world Ex PT10, ptf's we get our hands on the better we can accommodate the ducking & diving of Avid.

Domilik, re your OP, about getting clipgain to come across.
Sure ptf format only has track auto & there is no option in the 'Save Session Copy' dialogue to choose either track or clip vol as the data source for an export.
But ( I only have occasional access to PT10) is it not possible within PT10 to translate clip/region vol to track volume curves?

It might get a bit clumsy but as you doubtless know you can do 'Save as' versions of an edit or selected tracks in PT then add/ append these into Nuendo.

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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Kid Dropper Sound » Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:51 pm

They main issue with clip gain differences is that PT automatable node clip gain can go +36 and - INF db. The automation and static volume are one in the same. Nuendo has these as two separate mechanisms and it's automatable clip line can only go down in volume unless you first bring it down globally. I think at this stage, it is not a good idea to use this feature heavily if you plan to move to Nuendo. Stick to static volume lines and/or coalesce you gain to volume auto first. (remember you only have +12 head room on the fader, but on the other side you only have +6 db headroom on the nuendo fader.)
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:55 pm

I'm sure I never had such a fast and uncomplicated support by any software issue ever!

Contacted guys from aatranslator at 11:00, got a response at 11:30.
Sended them my test-session, and they immediately built a fix, which I got sended at 14:00!
Fix worked, but I still had this issue with non-linear fades, reported this to them, and got the next bugfix at 17:00!

Now x-fades are translated from PT10->PT9->Nuendo without problems!

Great work from people behind aatranslator! Thank you very much for this!

Regards,
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby neilwilkes » Sat Apr 28, 2012 4:32 pm

Domilik wrote:I'm sure I never had such a fast and uncomplicated support by any software issue ever!

Contacted guys from aatranslator at 11:00, got a response at 11:30.
Sended them my test-session, and they immediately built a fix, which I got sended at 14:00!
Fix worked, but I still had this issue with non-linear fades, reported this to them, and got the next bugfix at 17:00!

Now x-fades are translated from PT10->PT9->Nuendo without problems!

Great work from people behind aatranslator! Thank you very much for this!

Regards,
Domilik


THey are very, very good - not to mention seriously fast too.
I think AAT should be in everyone's toolkit, and it makes the SSL ProConvert seem like a joke - SSL still has no support for PT8, never mind 9 or 10. Oh, sorry - the cheaper Mac version does but us PC users never got the update and have been on the same build since December 2008 now.
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Kid Dropper Sound » Sat Apr 28, 2012 5:08 pm

Domilik wrote:I'm sure I never had such a fast and uncomplicated support by any software issue ever!

Contacted guys from aatranslator at 11:00, got a response at 11:30.
Sended them my test-session, and they immediately built a fix, which I got sended at 14:00!
Fix worked, but I still had this issue with non-linear fades, reported this to them, and got the next bugfix at 17:00!

Now x-fades are translated from PT10->PT9->Nuendo without problems!

Great work from people behind aatranslator! Thank you very much for this!

Regards,
Domilik


Is this working with clip automation as well as static lines?!?
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Sun Apr 29, 2012 6:42 am

Is this working with clip automation as well as static lines?!?

There is no clipgain translated since you have to convert a .ptf (pt7-9). Clipgain has to be rendered first. Volumeautomation is transfered.

In fact, coming from pt10 the translation is still a bit inaccurate, I had some further fade-issues and minor volume-changes (up to 0.7db). The ptf-files created in pt10 seem to have a different coding compared to real .ptf-files. But people at AAT are already working on this, so I'm pretty sure this will be fixed soon.
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby Domilik » Tue May 08, 2012 10:16 am

I'm happy to report that guys at AAT in between fixed all issues I reported to them in a phenomenal time, and I already imported two pt-sessions without any problems!

Clip-Editing, X-fades, Vol and Pan is working great! So no issues here when importing a simple edit or recording-session in last days.

I do not know if the new patched version is already online, you should ask for it if you plan to purchase.

PT10-support (that first of all means clipgain and interleaved stereo-handling) is still missing, but I'm sure they're already working on that... ;)
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby John Lundsten » Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:56 pm

Domilik wrote:
Is this working with clip automation as well as static lines?!?

There is no clipgain translated since you have to convert a .ptf (pt7-9). Clipgain has to be rendered first. Volumeautomation is transfered.
In fact, coming from pt10 the translation is still a bit inaccurate, I had some further fade-issues and minor volume-changes (up to 0.7db). The ptf-files created in pt10 seem to have a different coding compared to real .ptf-files. But people at AAT are already working on this, so I'm pretty sure this will be fixed soon.

Knowing what a major update (IE quite possibly very much WIP / a bit 'buggy', PT10 would be), we held off supporting native ptx format till it settled down from its initial development stage.

And we (misguidedly) hoped Avid could/would create good PT version 9 ptf's (that we can read quite well).

Now PT10 has improved a lot, but as to the 'quality' of their ptf exports;------
As documented by Avid there are (a) lot's of issues re ptf exports that have been been fixed, {10.0.0, was not nice} (b) there are still a lot of 'known issues' (c) in our experience [we are not alone] there are a number of possible (but not acknowledged by Avid) F***ups, [Hmm I mean 'undocumented features'] in their ptf exports.

So we have been working on supporting native PTX format. Lot's done (or works) re reading :--
Track; Names, Solo, Mute, Volume, Playlists.
Timeline Automation; Vol, Pan, Mute.
Clip; gain, envelope, mute, lock, Time/pitch stretch (TCE), Fades, Pan {ok some work still to do if not mono Media}.
Session; Markers, Video, Offset, BPM.

Stereo tracks using .L&.R media are recombined if 'Combine Split Mono Wav Files' is selected
When converting to Reaper stereo track pan mode is set to 'Dual Pan' and will display both L & R pans values {to other destinations, this is still WIP.
The thing is though PT10 has jumped from the 1980's to the 21st Century in terms of it's core code, it still has a very mono-centric approach, that no other DAW/NLE does. So we have more work to do to get good conversions to all the formats we supprt.
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Re: Translating Clipgain from PT10?

Postby dietrich » Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:03 am

With AATranslator Version 5.8001 it works fine! Just "Save Copy In..." in PT10 (v10.3.7), translate with AAT, and in Nuendo 6.0.7 there are Clip Gains, Track Automation, correct fades and Crossfade, Mutes, Marker.

The Best of all...

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