Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

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Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby musicom » Thu Dec 06, 2012 5:00 pm

I'm thinking about upgrading my system from 32 to 64 bit. I now have intel Q9450/Asus P5K-e wifi and 4GB RAM
I'm going for an Intel i7 3770K (39x is to expensive yet) with an Asus P8z77-X? mobo.

Main question which P8z77 mobo should I take? I have an Samsung SSD, 2 SATA2 HD, SATA1 10kraptor HD firewire card
I dont want to buy an expensive model with functions I never will use
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby Vocalpoint » Thu Dec 06, 2012 6:39 pm

musicom wrote:I'm thinking about upgrading my system from 32 to 64 bit. I now have intel Q9450/Asus P5K-e wifi and 4GB RAM
I'm going for an Intel i7 3770K (39x is to expensive yet) with an Asus P8z77-X? mobo.

Main question which P8z77 mobo should I take? I have an Samsung SSD, 2 SATA2 HD, SATA1 10kraptor HD firewire card
I dont want to buy an expensive model with functions I never will use



I went with the -V. Been rock solid across the board with no extra crap.

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby SLL » Thu Dec 06, 2012 7:38 pm

The Asus P8Z77-V , pro & deluxe version will also give you very low DPC latency out of the box. It's a great board!

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby musicom » Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:13 pm

Thnx
I think the choice remainly depends on what you use ( pci/ sata etc) i dont use the soundboard or wifi
I have 1 sata1 hd, 2 sata2 hd and 1sata3 ssd . I dont use raid. In the near future i will be using more ssd for my sample libraries when they become cheaper. And these will replace the sata2 hd's
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby lookbeat » Wed Dec 12, 2012 4:51 pm

I used Asus mb for a period. I never will back to asus again :cry: . I changed to intel DZ77GA-70K and now i'm very happy ;) :D

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby musicom » Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:02 pm

I never used anything else but ASUS never had any problems. They are highly recommended here mostley!
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:45 pm

what could have gone wrong with Asus , i never never had a problem with them , i rate them as the best , n they hv longivity , which i never found in any other M/ boards , but would like 2 see ur side of what went wrong .... sm
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby Vocalpoint » Thu Dec 13, 2012 8:30 pm

lookbeat wrote:I used Asus mb for a period. I never will back to asus again :cry: . I changed to intel DZ77GA-70K and now i'm very happy ;)


Intel was the only board that I ever owned - in 14 years of building - that actually died on me.

Just came back to ASUS (from Gigabyte) and this latest build was a dream for ease and practically instant usage. Can;t remember any build actually being in use within a day or two of building it - I usually have a several week quarantine as all oddities get worked out.

This one (P8Z77-V) hasn't even written one bad thing in the Event log since coming on line in September.

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby musicom » Fri Dec 14, 2012 10:01 am

Just ordered the ASUS P8Z77-V LE PLUS. (for other models I had to wait 14 days) It contains all I need. The -V has some stuff I wont use anyway. Together with an i7 3770k, Corsair (Vengeance LP 2x8GB 1600mhz cl9 RAM) and a Samsung 830 128 system disk I should be ok for the coming years!
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:20 pm

This one (P8Z77-V) hasn't even written one bad thing in the Event log since coming on line in September.
sorry didnt understand this , i only wish the P8 Z77 - V , or lower models , had just 3 Sata III / 6 Gb ports , not one of them in the lower cheaper segment with this feature , i would wonder if a PCI x card with a Sata 3 / 6 Gb/s might give the same performance , then i would b happy even with a P8Z 77 - V lX CHEAPER , N FULL ATX with 3 PCI slots 4 backward compatability ... wish Thunderbolt was included , but dt see any TB device in the market yet .. so. strangly , Asus M/ boards 4 AMD , has a lot more features @ a cheaper rate.... think i should b now going 4 a i 5 3450 .... would appreciate suggestions. thanks sm
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby Vocalpoint » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:12 pm

samwax wrote:This one (P8Z77-V) hasn't even written one bad thing in the Event log since coming on line in September.


The Windows 7 Event log. Usually every machine complains about something when first built :)

samwax wrote:I only wish the P8 Z77 - V , or lower models , had just 3 Sata III / 6 Gb ports , not one of them in the lower cheaper segment with this feature , i would wonder if a PCI x card with a Sata 3 / 6 Gb/s might give the same performance


And I do not understand this.

The Navy Blue and Grey ports on this board are certainly not in any "lower cheaper" segment. They are all 6GB/s. I use a single Intel (Grey ) port for my SSD and 2 of the Intel Blue 3GB connectors for the my two SATA hard disks.

Using a 6GB/s port only makes sense for SSD's - any normal SATA hard drive regardless of vintage can't take true advantage of a 6GB port so it's pointless to think that connecting a normal SATA hard disk to a 6GB SATA port is going to somehow "be better". These traditional "hard" disk designs can only go so fast - but they are not even close the speed of an SSD. And certainly do not require a 6GB SATA port.

Adding a PCI card ios a waste of money as well - ANY SATA port on this board can more than handle anything you can ever throw at it - if recording and editing audio is your intent.

I think you guys need to stop worrying so much about "performance" that you can never feel or measure and just pick one of the these boards and get down to it. They are all excellent, well tested and reliable. And are much more that is needed for a typical DAW.

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:31 pm

I think you guys need to stop worrying so much about "performance" that you can never feel or measure and just pick one of the these boards and get down to it. They are all excellent, well tested and reliable. And are much more that is needed for a typical DAW.


well if u say so , i just thought , that @ least the Os , the Vsti/s n the Audio rendering should hv been Sata 6/gb/s , but if ur point above is right , then i dont need to go 4 all those extras , a cheaper P8z77 should do fine , so keep an SSD on the Sata 6 Gb/s , n the Vsti/s n rendering ??? there will b only 1 more Sata 6 Gb/s n mostly 2 Sata 3 Gb/s any suggestions which should go where , or the rendering or vsti/s require the may b faster 6 Gb/s thats all , rest i ll pick up a normal ful ATX , yes i get hyper 2 see that every bit is perfect , but u r right , in what u say ..... i ll just look @ the board with 2 / PCI / PCIx slots , n thats it ..n i want to put a cheap fanless silent 1 Gb V card ... n i m done ... n i 5 3450.... any more suggestions ?? n No one answered this , would it make a difference if i kept a 500 Gb extra H/ Drive to load programmes only , n add a Turbo boost , sandisk Ready Cache 32 Gb ...

http://www.sandisk.com/products/ssd/sata/readycache/
would that add 2 the performance ???? i know this is crazy ideas , but would it help ease up taxing the CPU ????
n thanks 4 ur time n advice .
sm
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby Vocalpoint » Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:58 pm

samwax wrote:well if u say so , i just thought , that @ least the Os , the Vsti/s n the Audio rendering should hv been Sata 6/gb/s , but if ur point above is right , then i dont need to go 4 all those extras , a cheaper P8z77 should do fine , so keep an SSD on the Sata 6 Gb/s , n the Vsti/s n rendering ??? there will b only 1 more Sata 6 Gb/s n mostly 2 Sata 3 Gb/s any suggestions which should go where , or the rendering or vsti/s require the may b faster 6 Gb/s thats all , rest i ll pick up a normal ful ATX , yes i get hyper 2 see that every bit is perfect , but u r right , in what u say ..... i ll just look @ the board with 2 / PCI / PCIx slots , n thats it ..n i want to put a cheap fanless silent 1 Gb V card ... n i m done ... n i 5 3450.... any more suggestions ?? n No one answered this , would it make a difference if i kept a 500 Gb extra H/ Drive to load programmes only , n add a Turbo boost , sandisk Ready Cache 32 Gb ...

http://www.sandisk.com/products/ssd/sata/readycache/
would that add 2 the performance ???? i know this is crazy ideas , but would it help ease up taxing the CPU ????
n thanks 4 ur time n advice .
sm


Again - do not worry about "taxing" the CPU - it's designed to be taxed. How you want to set this up and how much money you want to spend is up to you but my standard DAW build has been like this forever.

1. An SSD for the OS and apps
2. A modern SATA for Recording
3. A modern SATA for samples

and that's it.

Readycache, TurboBoost and extra hard disk? Most of these is just hype to get you to spill more dollars. More hard drives equal more noise and more power drain and a larger noisier PSU and on and on. Your apps will never run faster (or better) than from a good SSD as your C:\ Drive.

Use the dollars you will spend on this useless stuff and get yourself the plain ole -V and an i7 3770K chip. You will have more power than any app will know what to do with. And have a DAW that will easily last several cycles in the hardware world.

Cheers,

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:28 pm

Use the dollars you will spend on this useless stuff and get yourself the plain ole -V and an i7 3770K chip. You will have more power than any app will know what to do with. And have a DAW that will easily last several cycles in the hardware world.
yap , just inquiring, if it would have been a short cut 2 better performance , looks like it not , but the i7 3770K is very expensive , the the turbo boost n H/ drive aint , n i dt have so many $$$ , i read that the i 5 3450 is close to the performance of the i 7 3770 K , i wouldnt want the k Oc , as i read that it voids warranty , i would prefer stock , n its cheaper , would appreciate if u could clarify just this point here , well all said , i try work it out ur way .... but would u suggest i7 stock or the i5 ??? the K would only give more performance if its OC/ed right ....??? this would kinda finalize my quest . thanks again sm
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby Vocalpoint » Sat Dec 15, 2012 4:02 pm

samwax wrote:yap , just inquiring, if it would have been a short cut 2 better performance , looks like it not , but the i7 3770K is very expensive , the the turbo boost n H/ drive aint , n i dt have so many $$$ , i read that the i 5 3450 is close to the performance of the i 7 3770 K , i wouldnt want the k Oc , as i read that it voids warranty , i would prefer stock , n its cheaper , would appreciate if u could clarify just this point here , well all said , i try work it out ur way .... but would u suggest i7 stock or the i5 ??? the K would only give more performance if its OC/ed right ....??? this would kinda finalize my quest . thanks again sm


I have always gone into a new DAW build with one major rule in mind - Always buy the "second" most powerful CPU out there at any given time. When I built this one (and even today) - the second most powerful CPU where I shop here in Calgary is the i7 3770K. I bought it according to the rule above not to overclock.

Now - I am not sure where you live but the difference between a high end i5 and this i7 here in Canada is about a 100 bucks. That's not a ton of cash but if I am going to be using this thing for three years - I am going to spend the money now - and over a 36 month period - that "extra" ends up costing about $2.50 a month - it's worth it to me.

Again - if the 3770K is too much - step down to the third most powerful and so on - til you hit a point where you feel good about the cash for the CPU.

Another rule: If you need to cut budget - don't cut on the CPU. It's the heart and soul of the operation...buy cheaper RAM or a cheaper PSU but stay firm on getting the best CPU you can afford.

Of course - this stuff always comes down to budget - but trust me - focus your main dollars into getting the very "best" big 3 (mobo, CPU and RAM) you can afford. Everything else is easy to swap in an out if you should change your mind. A good PSU is also a higher priority. I have had nothing but success and lots of enjoyment by sticking to these simple rules and spending wisely.

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Sun Dec 16, 2012 3:14 pm

Ya difference of 100 $ aint much , n ur point of view is gr8 , ill be doing just this , appreciate it , just this, if u dont OC , isnt the few $ wasted on the K series ??? may be can buy without the K , would that make a difference?? thanks n best wishes sam
sam de crasto # Braying Donkey Studious ,Edirol UA 101 , MAudio Delta 66/ Midisport 8X8 Trigger Finger , Roland UM - 3G Boss BR 1600 CD , DR 770, Yamaha DTxpress, Tascam Us 428 , KRK V 4 , Tascam 246, Evolution MK 361C , Roland PC 200 MK II , UltrDyne Pro 9024, Axon AX 50 , Ztar Z6S , Digitech Studio Vocalist , Beringer Power play , Roland EQ 231 , Roland Protues modules , Guitar synths , RMC X 3 interfaces , Makie 24 /8 Buss... Audiophile 24/96 , C 6.5 Halionsonic , Halion 4 , lots of old samplers Roland s760 my last , Bitstream X3 , n more ..
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby Vocalpoint » Sun Dec 16, 2012 4:22 pm

samwax wrote:Ya difference of 100 $ aint much , n ur point of view is gr8 , ill be doing just this , appreciate it , just this, if u dont OC , isnt the few $ wasted on the K series ??? may be can buy without the K , would that make a difference?? thanks n best wishes sam


Yes - buying without the K is totally an option. Should save you some cash there for sure.

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:42 pm

Thank you sam
sam de crasto # Braying Donkey Studious ,Edirol UA 101 , MAudio Delta 66/ Midisport 8X8 Trigger Finger , Roland UM - 3G Boss BR 1600 CD , DR 770, Yamaha DTxpress, Tascam Us 428 , KRK V 4 , Tascam 246, Evolution MK 361C , Roland PC 200 MK II , UltrDyne Pro 9024, Axon AX 50 , Ztar Z6S , Digitech Studio Vocalist , Beringer Power play , Roland EQ 231 , Roland Protues modules , Guitar synths , RMC X 3 interfaces , Makie 24 /8 Buss... Audiophile 24/96 , C 6.5 Halionsonic , Halion 4 , lots of old samplers Roland s760 my last , Bitstream X3 , n more ..
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Sat Jan 26, 2013 1:54 pm

n yes i had a office desk top with n i 3 , socket 1156 !!! lingering around , busted , i sent the Asus M/board 4 warranty , they replaced it instantly , n turned out , it was the 1st gen i 3 Intel that went bust , got that replaced as well, diagnostics were wrong only 4 the reason 1156 sockets r not very popular around here , even the dist didn't have n i3 around 2 verify the exact fault... main point Asus is a gr8 rugged M/ board... sm
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby Fly Studio » Sat Feb 09, 2013 6:31 pm

The price difference between the i7-3770 and the i7-3770K is about $20 - $30 if you shop around.
There is a performance difference even at stock speeds. The K is 3.5GHz per core; the plain 3770 is 3.4GHz per core.
Check the CPU benchmark here: http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu_lookup.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i7-3770K+%40+3.50GHz&id=2 and price/performance here: http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i7-3770K+%40+3.50GHz&id=2

Even though the plain 3770 is rated slightly higher in price/performance ratio and the 3770K appears to have a relatively small performance advantage, look at it this way: 3 - 4 years from now, when the new Haswell / Broadwell platform is out and we are running Cubase 9 and goodness knows what plugins and VSTi's that take advantage of the latest computer performance available, wouldn't it be nice to be able to overclock, or at least have that extra bit of juice from your CPU?

Anyway, that benchmark used a combination of tests, some that don't have much relevance for DAW work. I have seen DAW benchmarks (at stock speeds) that indicate even higher performance gains with the 3770K over the 3770. Apparently there is more under the hood than the extra 400MHz gained. And CPU speed is the 1st factor for lower latencies (generally; provided there are no other bottlenecks, like slow RAM or a bad mobo layout; 3 years ago, I replaced my BGF 680i mobo with an Asus 680i mobo and immediately noticed a difference, without reloading the OS).

I've seen a lot of Asus P8Z77 mobo + 3770K DAW builds listed; I don't recall seeing any 3770 builds.
People on a budget usually go with the i5-3570K ($80 - $100 less, 4 core, no Hyperthreading).

Another point: the K is unlocked for overclocking. Intel would not certify a CPU for overclocking that can't take it (okay, a debatable point). Chances are the K will be more robust and last longer if you run it cool at stock speeds.

If you are on a super tight budget, I am sure the 3770 (or i5-3570K) will be fine. I just like to 'future-proof' my build as far as possible.

Also, if you are considering AMD, you should know that they have stopped competing with Intel for high performance, so don't expect a good CPU upgrade to become available on that platform. Plus, a comparable AMD processor draws 125 watts compared to the 3770K's 77 watts. More watts = more heat = noisier (or more expensive) cooling + higher electric bills and possibly shorter lifespan.

I also like Asus; it is up to the feature set you need, like # of PCIe/PCI slots (bandwidth dictates a limited combination of each), LAN, Wi-Fi, etc. The Intel LAN on the V, V-Pro & higher is supposed to be better & more efficient than the cheaper chips used on the LX, LE & LK. Also, the V-Pro & up have more PCIe, Sata and USB lanes and/or ports and better controller chips. YGWYPF.

The V, V-Pro & Deluxe have progressively more power phases and digital power control, if that means anything.
And you can take a chance on the V-Pro Thunderbolt for a few more bucks than the V-Pro, but you lose the Display Port & the 2 USB 2.0 ports on the back (but there are 5 2x internal connectors for up to 10 USB 2 ports, if you have a place to mount the expansion rails). There is also sharing w/ the TH, one of the USB 3 ports and one of the Sata ports. I think you can turn off TH until you need it (in a couple years...) to free up that bandwidth. I'll let you know how the Asus V-Pro/TH works in a few weeks, if all goes well.

Hope this helps.

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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:10 am

Even though the plain 3770 is rated slightly higher in price/performance ratio and the 3770K appears to have a relatively small performance advantage, look at it this way: 3 - 4 years from now, when the new Haswell / Broadwell platform is out and we are running Cubase 9 and goodness knows what plugins and VSTi's that take advantage of the latest computer performance available, wouldn't it be nice to be able to overclock, or at least have that extra bit of juice from your CPU?
Thanks thats was gr8 info , well 4 now i got n i3 , just for going on , but ur points are excellent , there is an i5 3470 T ( T) that stands 4 Hyper threading , which i read is good 4 C6/7 , thats the only CPU i seen out there ,n i m trying to get that , n if u minutely read the Z77 chip set in the Higher mid section M/board without the extra pro costs , there r some ** on the specifications , which adds some jumper pins on the board where u can later add a module , if n when when thunderbolt gets more popular , available n cheaper , thanks sm
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby Fly Studio » Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:42 pm

No problem; I've been researching for a new build and happen to have looked at all the recent info I could find.

I saw that header on the mobo and thought it might be for adding THBolt in the future; I figured pay the extra $5 now and have it in the bios etc.. Oh, that's right, it's not a Bios anymore; it's a UEFI....

I have to wonder about Steinberg's attention to their website: their 'Optimizing Windows for DAWs' page seems like old info. I am curious: it says to turn Hyperthreading off.
I haven't put together my new system yet, but if Steiny hasn't figured out a way to take advantage of hyperthreading by Cubase 7, it is a disappointment. Unles of course there is a fundamental architectural issue that can't be bypassed.

It also says to change the visual setting to 'Best Performance'. That might be pertinent for an older Win XP system, but I have read that Aero in Win 7 off-loads the visual processing to the Video Card, and turning it off forces the CPU to do the calculations for plugin GUI's, etc. So unless you are using integrated/shared graphics, it is better to leave it on. Interesting. Will be interesting to see if this makes a difference with Cubase 7/ Wavelab 6/7 on Win 7 64 bit w/ a powerful graphics card..

I guess this is a bit off topic..
G
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Re: Upgrading to Asus P8z77 mobo but which one?

Postby samwax » Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:27 pm

I have to wonder about Steinberg's attention to their website: their 'Optimizing Windows for DAWs' page seems like old info. I am curious: it says to turn Hyperthreading off.

was definite i read here somewhere that Hyperthreading is definitely a + 4 performance in Cubase , can not vouch 4 it though ... sm
sam de crasto # Braying Donkey Studious ,Edirol UA 101 , MAudio Delta 66/ Midisport 8X8 Trigger Finger , Roland UM - 3G Boss BR 1600 CD , DR 770, Yamaha DTxpress, Tascam Us 428 , KRK V 4 , Tascam 246, Evolution MK 361C , Roland PC 200 MK II , UltrDyne Pro 9024, Axon AX 50 , Ztar Z6S , Digitech Studio Vocalist , Beringer Power play , Roland EQ 231 , Roland Protues modules , Guitar synths , RMC X 3 interfaces , Makie 24 /8 Buss... Audiophile 24/96 , C 6.5 Halionsonic , Halion 4 , lots of old samplers Roland s760 my last , Bitstream X3 , n more ..
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