So 7.5 is here (almost)

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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby forthwith » Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:29 pm

suntower wrote:Besides the 'BIG NEW FEATURES!' we never know what is in the box until -after- we install---and that's not always cool for a mission-critical app.


I think we must always ask the question, if Steinberg allow previous versions to be used with a current license, then what is in the new version that you need, which cannot be lived without in the previous (stable) version.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby Fabio Bartolini » Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:30 pm

suntower wrote:Good to hear. On behalf of long-time users... it would REALLY be appreciated if you pre-published at least a -tentative- set of -small- improvements/scheduled fixes such as I have asked for. Many of us really have no need for most of the new VSTis, etc. Mostly we want to know what has been fixed---or what the strategy is for addressing these things. This is a -very- different audience from those who are interested in LoopMash etc.

Marketing is important of course. But certainly you already have a list of fixes and improvements, so why not publish when you make your big promo announcements? , It is my feeling that what I'm asking for is the right way to treat people who depend on Cubase (as I do) for our living. Besides the 'BIG NEW FEATURES!' we never know what is in the box until -after- we install---and that's not always cool for a mission-critical app.


The list of fixes / improvements will be published afterwards, I'm afraid.
Sorry, but it is not a tech support duty. I'll pass the request, though.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby Fabio Bartolini » Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:34 pm

trashdinner wrote:Hey Fabio, thx for participating in the forum during your free days! would it be possible for you to confirm the US price for 7.5 and will it be taken off of the C8 upgrade? Thx ... I can't wait for 7.5!


Fixed that for you :lol:

I'm home and frankly, I don't know the US pricing.
In EU it is 49,99€ like C6 -> C6.5, should be the same for the US.
Sorry again for not being precise.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby ufoqbase » Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:34 pm

Fabio Bartolini wrote:
Nope, sorry. It is the 3rd party developers that need to test their software with Cubase, not the other way around.

We also do not have licenses or know all of the stuff out there. I'm gladly testing the ones I privately own licenses for and download demos of the problematic ones when I receive a report. But it is the plug-in which needs to be tested in Cubase, not the other way around. A host cannot be built around plug-ins.



Ok I can agree with you, if the new version was Rock solid, I still remember all the problems with mixer, bus configuration, channels trips, compressors than I met first time used C7, and I was not opened any old plugs yet. So why I don't have these problems with 6.5.5 under 64bit? :D Im not talking about new plugs or new release of these plugs, I can't work with Cubase7 under OSX, maybe under Windows works great I don't know. I don't remember some kind of alerts about "Cubase 7 it's not guaranted with 3rd parts plugs like 6.5" because means beta testing from someone.... me and other users feels like beta tester and you can't do nothing to change this, We are here after 1 year
...... sounds like a song... :lol:
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby trashdinner » Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:38 pm

Fabio Bartolini wrote:
trashdinner wrote:Hey Fabio, thx for participating in the forum during your free days! would it be possible for you to confirm the US price for 7.5 and will it be taken off of the C8 upgrade? Thx ... I can't wait for 7.5!


Fixed that for you :lol:

I'm home and frankly, I don't know the US pricing.
In EU it is 49,99€ like C6 -> C6.5, should be the same for the US.
Sorry again for not being precise.


Thx a lot!! That's all I needed to know. Have a great "not really free" day ;)
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby ufoqbase » Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:40 pm

I will stop this discussion, it's too obvious at now. I will not upgrade to 7.5 until a super rock solid version under osx, and I will not upgrade to 8 if Steinberg will not fix all bugs and compatibility problems with 3rd party plugs... :D
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby Fabio Bartolini » Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:43 pm

ufoqbase wrote:So why I don't have these problems with 6.5.5 under 64bit?


Mmmhh, I don't know? Could it be because of the VST SDK 2.3 and older support being dropped?

If you PM me a list of problematic plug-ins, I'll gladly check out. I own a lot of 3rd party plug-ins and use to beta-test for devs I know (for free, yes!)... so maybe I can help.

@trashdinner: thank you!
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby trashdinner » Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:50 pm

ufoqbase wrote:I will stop this discussion, it's too obvious at now. I will not upgrade to 7.5 until a super rock solid version under osx, and I will not upgrade to 8 if Steinberg will not fix all bugs and compatibility problems with 3rd party plugs... :D


The only real issue C7 had with 3rd party plugins was with audio damage plugins on 7.0 ... it was fixed a while ago. I had some 3rd party plugins issues in the past and it wasn't cubase fault ... I used to be on Adobe Audition and it was hell compared to Cubase. I then switched to Pro Tools because that's what we were using at school and I had huge crashes and that was back in the days when Pro Tools didn,t have any auto backup options so I was always loosing precious work :( When I switched to Cubase I never looked back! I've seen a benchmark test somewhere (I can't find it but I'll post the link if I do) and they tested all the major DAWs on the market and inserted as many plugins as possible (all 3rd parties) and Cubase was almost always on top for the most plugins while still being reliable. Pro tools was not so far behind but Studio One, Logic and all the other where really far behind. Steiny also fixed some UAD plugins issues that were happening in rare occasions in Cubase. Seriously, if you have doubts, try another DAW and you'll be thankfull for Cubase.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby suntower » Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:03 pm

Thanks. I realise this is not your job, but since you're the only apparent connection with management, you must realise it's the only option most of us have in making our needs known. It's been many years since someone at the level of Charlie/Lars/Dave/etc. actually engaged with users about needs/wants/desires so all we can do is beg/plead with front-line people.

This is similar to most big, faceless, utilities where the end users are pretty much powerless. I understand the advantages for management (and for -you- to be able to say "I only work here"), but I'm not sure it's the image your company really wants to project.

Best,

---JC

Fabio Bartolini wrote:
suntower wrote:Good to hear. On behalf of long-time users... it would REALLY be appreciated if you pre-published at least a -tentative- set of -small- improvements/scheduled fixes such as I have asked for. Many of us really have no need for most of the new VSTis, etc. Mostly we want to know what has been fixed---or what the strategy is for addressing these things. This is a -very- different audience from those who are interested in LoopMash etc.

Marketing is important of course. But certainly you already have a list of fixes and improvements, so why not publish when you make your big promo announcements? , It is my feeling that what I'm asking for is the right way to treat people who depend on Cubase (as I do) for our living. Besides the 'BIG NEW FEATURES!' we never know what is in the box until -after- we install---and that's not always cool for a mission-critical app.


The list of fixes / improvements will be published afterwards, I'm afraid.
Sorry, but it is not a tech support duty. I'll pass the request, though.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby Fabio Bartolini » Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:07 pm

suntower wrote:Thanks. I realise this is not your job, but since you're the only apparent connection with management, you must realise it's the only option most of us have in making our needs known. It's been many years since someone at the level of Charlie/Lars/Dave/etc. actually engaged with users about needs/wants/desires so all we can do is beg/plead with front-line people.

This is similar to most big, faceless, utilities where the end users are pretty much powerless. I understand the advantages for management (and for -you- to be able to say "I only work here"), but I'm not sure it's the image your company really wants to project.

Best,

---JC


Thank you.

Feel free to ask, if I cannot reply because it is not my duty, I'll ask to the proper people if it is possible to give out the required info. Nothing wrong with asking!
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby Svenne » Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:59 pm

ufoqbase wrote:Svenne please... you don't understand what we are talking about, 49euro are not expensive, are offensive for people brought cubase last year and can't use it for almost 10months after 149euro spent upgrading from 6.5. That's the point.

Who are "we"? Are you royalty

I went from v5 to v7, so I payed significantly more than you. I felt cheated that Steinberg started regarding .5 increases as pay-for upgrade with 6.5, but I don't see much point in nagging about it. Before that I payed ≈ €40 for a "free" grace period upgrade from v4 to v5.

I still don't find the €49 price neither expensive, nor offensive. Remind me, what was the upgrade cost from v6 to v.6.5?

If Your Majesty feel offended, don't bother upgrading. Nobody's forcing you. Nobody's forcing you to use Cubase at all!
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby uarte » Sat Nov 30, 2013 11:06 pm

Very much looking forward to C7.5. The features on paper look like a great balance of workflow features and "goodies" that make for good marketing. Steinberg has to balance this out so they can stay in business. In my book, they made some great choices for C7.5. Hopefully the implementation will be very solid. The Track Versions feature alone is worth the upgrade price for me, personally. My workflow will be greatly improved. Well done, Steinberg!
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby orchetect » Sat Nov 30, 2013 11:22 pm

I'm actually surprised that Steinberg did as much as they did in the workflow enhancements. We could have nothing but some new synths but we also have a new take on instrument tracks, track versions, track visibility and transient tools that I honestly didn't expect until 8.0.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby uarte » Sat Nov 30, 2013 11:27 pm

orchetect wrote:I'm actually surprised that Steinberg did as much as they did in the workflow enhancements. We could have nothing but some new synths but we also have a new take on instrument tracks, track versions, track visibility and transient tools that I honestly didn't expect until 8.0.



I agree completely. Steinberg put some killer features into 7.5 that could have easily waited for 8.0 if they wanted. Frankly, they just needed one or two more flagship features, another few mid-level features, and this could have easily been 8.0. To me, this is one of the best X.5 updates I've ever seen.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby distante » Sun Dec 01, 2013 12:00 am

I'm not in Europe or USA... do I have different prices?
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby papi61 » Sun Dec 01, 2013 12:32 am

mpayne0 wrote:Again, without "beatzmakers" who are you sound engineering for? This attitude and lack of respect would not get a dollar from me.


Who said anything about me being an engineer? I'm a classically-trained composer with a Ph.D. "beatzmakers" are DJ's, remixers, whatever you want to call them, but they don't actually make music, just rearrange someone else's loops.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby Makumbaria » Sun Dec 01, 2013 12:41 am

distante wrote:I'm not in Europe or USA... do I have different prices?


I don´t think so. I'm in Brazil, and from here I have to pay in euros at Steinberg shop(but without VAT), to me would be better to pay in US dollars.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby beerbong » Sun Dec 01, 2013 12:53 am

What is the word on Mixconsole undo functions?

How about better shortcuts for automation(right click menu) and visable automation markers similar to Reason.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby suntower » Sun Dec 01, 2013 1:14 am

orchetect wrote:I'm actually surprised that Steinberg did as much as they did in the workflow enhancements. We could have nothing but some new synths but we also have a new take on instrument tracks, track versions, track visibility and transient tools that I honestly didn't expect until 8.0.


I guess it will come down to one's definition of 'workflow enhancements'. They may be marvelous, but I have 3 observations:

1. With 7.0, it -looked- like SB was heading in an 'app' direction... trying very much to -simplify- the UI. These features will surely make the UI more complicated. That seems like a step backward between the UI designer's intent and the rest of the team that does 'features'.

2. All these new features seem far more like traditional SB approach---add more stuff rather than -perfecting- what is there. IOW: I'm not sure 'versioning' =and= Lanes =and= 'Rerecord' =and= the 6.5 comping stuff couldn't be streamlined into a MUCH more simple method that was just as 'flexible' but didn't require as much 'stuff'. Eg. If the mixer simply had fader undo/redo history? I probably wouldn't need -half- of all that stuff.

3. My concern is that MixConsole is FAR from perfect. In fact, I work -slower- with it than with the 6.0 mixer. Just a fact. I was hoping that all the keyboard navigation stuff would be sorted out before it was imposed on the rest of Cubase UI. That worries me as a guy who twiddles in the Editors all day.

IOW: There were LOTS 'better' music players, with LOTS more features before the iPod came out. It turns out that a simple, intuitive design is far more valuable to most people than winning the feature war.

Or, like most pundits, I could be completely wrong. :D The ID thing and the improvements to Score are most welcome for me.

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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby StefK » Sun Dec 01, 2013 3:35 am

forthwith wrote:
StefK wrote:If the specs+documentation cannot be realised in the software, then, the software is not fit for purpose, and (again IMO) the marketing and documentation that gets published with the 'released software' should be amended detailing to consumers that the feature sets are not available.


That's a joke, right?

...I'm tired of shelling out the 49 (or whatever) euro every year, in the hope / belief that this will be the stable release, I keep seeing, all these glossy new iDEVICE apps, and new synths, and tools, and bits and pieces, but still not seeing a rock solid foundation and framework from SB.


Maybe you misinterpret the meaning of .5, it is for features not improvements.


..yep its a joke awright !
I do appreciate that the .5 release (in a release version control convention of x.y.z (where y=5 in our case), is meant for functional and feature enrichment. I have NO probs with what y=5 means, this is typical release branding notation, which I am VERY familiar with.

Isn't interesing that SB, have not called it "7.1.0" (and the same was done in 6.0 to 6.5, why did this not go to 6.1?)?? It encompases functional/feature enrichment, it should have been incremented up by only one minor branch release on the code-tree node.
Is moving to a midpoint [ .5 ] somehow supposed to qualm the user community, into a miss belief that this is nearly a major architectural upgrade [which btw imo seemed accurate to do b/w 6 and 7 release].

One could imagine and specualte at the market acceptance, if it was branded as 6.1 - and now 7.1 [which it should be versioned at this level - in my opinion], and the user-noise that would've probably resulted == and no doubt in my opinion, un noticed.

I do not have probs with SB releasing new version of 7.5 and feature enrichement, just pointing out that there are many issues still not working as they should be in the core 7.0.z branch of the software.

Looking at SB past patch (.z) release schedule, I could not see them releasing more than another two (at absolute best 3) patch itterations, taking 7.0.z to at best around 7.0.9. Looking at the payload of core issues, and what is delivered as part of the patch re-dress [in the patch release notes] , I am still not seeing a high yield ratio of corrections to apparent functional requirements that are not operating satisfactorily.

Sure, there are as other members have pointed out, other corrections that are addressed (and not often listed in the fix.release.notes {which as a developer myself, scares me a little}.


It is obvious [to me at least] to see and observe this in the reading of so many frustrated users on this
forum, = yes I too am one of 'em.
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby StefK » Sun Dec 01, 2013 3:45 am

cpechet1 wrote:It’s the same thing every time an update is announced…

Compiled *witch* List

1. It should be free… free.. free.. free… I want it to be free… Everything should be free… free… free… Everything except me because, well, because…
2. I hate these new features…. hate… hate… hate… hate these new features… I’ll never use them and they suck anyway event though I’ve never used them and don’t know a thing about them…
3. I want the old mixer back… Give me the old mixer… Give me the old mixer… I hate the new mixer… hate… hate… hate…
4. There should be 500 different versions of Cubase… No, 1000 versions, no 100,000 versions. One made specially for me… me… me… me…
5. Cubase sucks and I hate so I’m switching to Reaper/Pro Tools/Logic/Garage Band/MS Word… Until next week when I download the update because I hate Reaper/Pro Tools/Logic/Garage Band/MS Word…
6. All software except Cubase is perfect… perfect… perfect… perfect… It all works exactly perfectly… It even works when I’m not using it… And its free free free… And I have my own version of it that they gave me for free… And did I mention its perfect?


Steinberg does a damn fine job of building ridiculously complex software which sells at a ridiculously low price.


I agree! If we had some free steak knives thrown into the bundle though....
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby forthwith » Sun Dec 01, 2013 3:57 am

StefK wrote:Sure, there are as other members have pointed out, other corrections that are addressed (and not often listed in the fix.release.notes {which as a developer myself, scares me a little}.


Hi Stef,

I believe it was noted by a staff member that there will be at least 2 updates to come notwithstanding 7.5 (one prior to release of a whole numbered version and another post release) and while I am willing to stand corrected, I believe that history supports this view so therefore I am completely at ease with how SB operate.

Cheers
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby distante » Sun Dec 01, 2013 7:22 am

Makumbaria wrote:
distante wrote:I'm not in Europe or USA... do I have different prices?


I don´t think so. I'm in Brazil, and from here I have to pay in euros at Steinberg shop(but without VAT), to me would be better to pay in US dollars.


Yeap because the change is hell...
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby rustman » Sun Dec 01, 2013 9:21 am

Fabio Bartolini wrote:
Nope, sorry. It is the 3rd party developers that need to test their software with Cubase, not the other way around.

We also do not have licenses or know all of the stuff out there. I'm gladly testing the ones I privately own licenses for and download demos of the problematic ones when I receive a report. But it is the plug-in which needs to be tested in Cubase, not the other way around. A host cannot be built around plug-ins.


This is absolutely true. I am not a power user yet, but every crash that I've had has been a result of a third party plugin. Using a wrapper for a 32 bit plug is asking for it and I accept that. I'm phasing them out and moving towards all 64 bit stuff. Using free plugins is always a gamble. Some are great and some, not so much. I accept the risk if I load them. I'm buying lots of top shelf 64 bit plugins to get my system in stable, quality condition. I built a stable, stonkin' machine to run C7 on and it's towing the line. Having said this, I like 7.0.6 alot. For me, one of the biggest annoyances is waiting about a minute for Alchemy to load. That is not a C7 problem.

I DO think that point upgrades are a bit irritating. Pay for 7.0 or 8.0, but keep anything to the right of the decimal free for appearances sake only. Hold on to these new features until 8 comes out and then sell me on them. I haven't had 7 for even nine months, maybe only 6, and now I have to weigh the temptation to buy this incremental version?
I don't have to buy it, so it's not a huge deal really. I just feel warmer and fuzzier if I can be up to date for a year or so before I have to start stressing over whether to upgrade. Updates are great. Bring them on to fix bugs. There will always be bugs. Period. It's the nature of programming for such a wide array of devices and software environments.
Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit, i7 2600K @ 4.6 Ghz, 16 Gb RAM @ 2133, Radeon HD 5650 x2 in Crossfire, 27" Viewsonic monitors x3, Novation 61SL mk2, Roland Quad-Capture, SSD boot and recording drives, SATA drive for sample library, Komplete 9 Ultimate, Alchemy, Omnisphere, Stylus RMS, Trilian, Synthmaster, Zebra2, ZebraHZ, Iris, Total Studio 3, Melodyne Editor, Entire Image-Line product Catalog, Reason 6.5, Reaper, MFM2, Filterscape, Blue Cat goodies, Melda Productions Total bundle, SD2, SSD4 Platinum, POD Farm2, >100K midi drum loops. -----> and DIVA!!!!
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Re: So 7.5 is here (almost)

Postby mrjixies » Sun Dec 01, 2013 9:40 am

trashdinner wrote:Ok ... the ranting is really annoying and 7.5 is not even out yet :S Seriously, if you're not happy about it then just don't buy it!


The fact is we all ready BOUGHT cubase 7! And I dont mind paying for an upgrade with new features. HOWEVER I do mind paying for mayor FLAWS being fixed in a PAID UPDATE! If these mayor flaws are being fixed in 7.0.7 you wont hear another word from me.

But with steinberg, It's like buying a new car with a stuttering engine, yes you can go from a to b but it's not going to be a smooth ride. When you go back to the dealer they promise to fix the engine, but they also will repaint the car, put a nice spoiler on the back, change the seat covers and BILL you for it! But I just wanted the engine to be fixed??? Sorry chap, thats just not possible at steinberg's garage!
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