7.5 keycommand focus

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7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mozart » Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:35 am

Can someone clarify for me before I upgrade from 6.5 to 7.5?

I thought I had read somewhere that if the mix window is in focus then key commands for the arrange window don't work until you click back in the arrange window. Is this true?

Bit of a workflow killer for me if so.....
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Rhino » Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:04 am

Been that way since 7.0, more than a year now. :roll:
No fix in sight, just deafening silence.
We got loops and mash and other lifesavers instead.
Sounds bad ? Wait till you experience it in person. :shock:
The good news - 6.5 is still working great !
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mozart » Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:11 am

Thanks for your reply. Oh dear. As I feared.

What actually happens? Is it only key commands that are the same (conflicting) that cause problems?

For example.if there was a mixer key command that clashed with a project window one, could I delete the mixer one and then, even with the mixer in focus, have that key command operate in the project window?
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Rhino » Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:27 am

Nope, just out of the blue. :?
Believe me, we tried any workaround imaginable.
We, that is the minority using KCs here.
It is what it is, unless that is fixed there will be no more upgrades from me.
And I've been the typical early adopter all those years since SX1, even wrote the 1st report worldwide once about a major version upgrade. There always were a few little issues in .0 versions, but never a complete showstopper for me.
Usually I was up and running two days after release ...
Sorry for the bad news, I usually prefer to offer solutions.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mrjixies » Sat Dec 07, 2013 8:59 am

I think its weird that no one has tested this with 7.5???
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Steve Helstrip » Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:56 am

There's no change with the key focus. I find it a slight distraction, but it's not a show stopper for me. All your regular key command work for transport, etc.

It's no different, really, to having a plug-in open. Some keys work, some do not.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Rhino » Sat Dec 07, 2013 1:14 pm

Don't know about you, but I only have a limited amount of tentacles available. :lol:
There's the guitar, the PC keyboard, the controllers - the mouse tends to be the one without "hand attached" here most of the time.
Constantly having to reach for it to perform a totally unnecessary focus switch, back to keyboard for the KC, mouse again to switch back, hand back to where it was before, borders on absurd compared to the single keystroke that has been needed up to 6.5. :roll:
It's not like there were a clear benefit / trade off, like with, say, the right click toolbox, it's just unnecessarily broken, and it hits me constantly in 7.x, several times a minute ... :shock:
Even worse, as the Generic Remote is plagued with the identical bug, since it's mostly a front end for key commands.

I'm perfectly aware it is less of an issue for single screen users and those that constantly have the mouse in hand, but there are types of fast and efficient workflow that get absolutely killed by this bug.
And every single project studio round here has similar key ingredients, desktop workstation, mixer & arrange open simultaneously on two or more screens, hardware controllers, more likely something based on GR than a Euphonix or Nuage, guitar optional.
Guess what Cubase version they are still using ?
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Woodcrest Studio » Sat Dec 07, 2013 3:33 pm

Do you know you can ctrl-tab through open windows?
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Rhino » Sat Dec 07, 2013 4:19 pm

Woodcrest Studio wrote:Do you know you can ctrl-tab through open windows?

Sure, thanks !
Not exactly intuitive or fast, though, sorry.
You could also hide the mixer and open it again to bring it in focus, to reactivate the arrange window there's a key command at least ...
Kinda hard to beat the simple elegance of keystrokes just doing what they were invented for, without any further fuss.
Like they always did, for good reasons.
No, this should never have been broken, or at least hotfixed immediately.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mrjixies » Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:44 pm

Its absurd that this still hasnt been fixed! It was working fine in 6.5. The way it is now is like opening the automatic windows from your car. The button is on the outside, so you first have to open the door to reach it...
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby SteveInChicago » Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:54 pm

TimoWildenhain wrote:Key Command/mixer issue will (most likely) be fixed.


viewtopic.php?f=194&t=50956&start=25
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Rhino » Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:16 pm

Thanks, Steve !
the first vague sign of acknowledgement in over a year, ETA some other day ...
we'll see what tangible results will come out of this.
meanwhile I hope the discussion will keep alive !
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mozart » Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:13 am

Thanks for all replies. Can you remove any key commands for the mixer that clash with ones you have set up for the project window?
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby JMCecil » Mon Dec 09, 2013 2:15 pm

mozart wrote:Thanks for all replies. Can you remove any key commands for the mixer that clash with ones you have set up for the project window?

There is currently no way to clash. There are no context key commands. Another reason that this being broken is so weird. If this was the first step is having context oriented key commands, I can see where the problem comes from. But, if they were going to do that, it shouldn't have been dropped in 2 years before they were going to implement it.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mozart » Mon Dec 09, 2013 3:48 pm

Sorry - probably being dim. Could you explain a bit more about there being no clash?
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby JMCecil » Mon Dec 09, 2013 3:49 pm

mozart wrote:Sorry - probably being dim. Could you explain a bit more about there being no clash?

You can't assign the same keystroke to multiple commands.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mozart » Mon Dec 09, 2013 3:57 pm

Ah I see what you mean.

So can I ask, if I have custom key commands for the project window that I use in 6.5 that have been assigned, by default, to mixer functions in 7.5, could I assign those keys back to my custom project key commands and then use them, even if the mixer window is in focus?
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby JMCecil » Mon Dec 09, 2013 4:01 pm

mozart wrote:Ah I see what you mean.

So can I ask, if I have custom key commands for the project window that I use in 6.5 that have been assigned, by default, to mixer functions in 7.5, could I assign those keys back to my custom project key commands and then use them, even if the mixer window is in focus?

errrr ... hard to follow that.

You can only have 1 set of commands. Doesn't matter if it is 6.5 or 7.5. So if you imported your 6.5 key commands into 7.5, it would continue to work exactly as today.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mozart » Mon Dec 09, 2013 4:06 pm

Thanks for your reply.

Maybe I have misunderstood the problem / bug that exists. Sorry if that's the case. I was under the impression that if the mix window is in focus, then some / all key commands relating to other windows (in my particular hypothetical situation, the project window) become inactive until you use the mouse to change focus back to the project window.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby JMCecil » Mon Dec 09, 2013 5:09 pm

mozart wrote:Thanks for your reply.

Maybe I have misunderstood the problem / bug that exists. Sorry if that's the case. I was under the impression that if the mix window is in focus, then some / all key commands relating to other windows (in my particular hypothetical situation, the project window) become inactive until you use the mouse to change focus back to the project window.

It's typically reported the other way round. When you are on the project window, quite a few of the mixconsole commands don't work, like changing the view using the configuration hotkeys.

However, there are (were?) scenarios that worked the other way as well, like opening an editor on selected items. I haven't tried. I just tested the scenario above and figured nothing has changed and pressed on.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby SteveInChicago » Mon Dec 09, 2013 5:15 pm

Also, this is related to the way Cubase deals with focus overall, not just Key Commands. For example, it is possible to be working in an Always-on-Top window and hit a key that does nothing in the window, but edits something in another window.

In my view this is a serious issue.
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby mozart » Mon Dec 09, 2013 5:31 pm

Thanks . I understand the situation a bit better now. :-) May just have to take the plunge and see what effect any of this has on my workflow. If it does, I'll retrace steps to 6.5 and wait :-)
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby SteveInChicago » Mon Dec 09, 2013 5:42 pm

There are many improvements for composers in 7 and 7.5. You probably won't be sorry. ;)
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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Rhino » Mon Dec 09, 2013 7:19 pm

SteveInChicago wrote:Also, this is related to the way Cubase deals with focus overall, not just Key Commands. For example, it is possible to be working in an Always-on-Top window and hit a key that does nothing in the window, but edits something in another window.
In my view this is a serious issue.

Exactly.
Can't speak for others, but for many routine operations using key commands had become a bit like typing "10 fingers blind" style for me, you could rely on them being carried out without necessarily needing constant visual feedback, this is not possible any more. :(

JMCecil wrote:It's typically reported the other way round. When you are on the project window, quite a few of the mixconsole commands don't work, like changing the view using the configuration hotkeys.
However, there are (were?) scenarios that worked the other way as well, like opening an editor on selected items. I haven't tried. I just tested the scenario above and figured nothing has changed and pressed on.

True, because arrange > mixer is the most obvious scenario, easiest to explain / reproduce.
Like Steve said, the issue has many faces.

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Re: 7.5 keycommand focus

Postby Rhino » Mon Dec 09, 2013 7:21 pm

mozart wrote:Maybe I have misunderstood the problem / bug that exists. Sorry if that's the case. I was under the impression that if the mix window is in focus, then some / all key commands relating to other windows (in my particular hypothetical situation, the project window) become inactive until you use the mouse to change focus back to the project window.

Correct, although that's only part of the problem, see above.
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