What is going on with Cubase 7?

General discussions on songwriting, mixing, music business and other music related topics.

What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby MrSmith » Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:46 pm

Here's what I have observed being a customer of Steinberg since 2012:

    - Beta testing for new versions is non-existent.

    - Older versions are known to be more stable while the workflow/operation issues are growing in # each version.

    - The timeframe for known bug fixes is usually 60 days+.

    - The fixes aren't thorough/don't address issues (some bugs have been around for years).

    - Many of the critical 'features' need improvement/don't work as intended (ASIO guard, channel strip chain)

    - They bloat the UI, limit user customization, make many things less intuitive (7.5 instrument rack, departure from cubase 6 ASIO meter).

    - Documentation on ASIO functionality is not thorough and unavailable to the public.

Cubase 7-7.5, in it's current state, works great for some people. And 7.0 helped me make some great music. But there are intrinsically broken functions that go unfixed for months at a time (IF AT ALL!).

Why are we forced to put up with this if we want to use this application? What if the people at Steinberg, as well-intending as they may be, were actually developers that took an active interest in making the program better for it's customers? Not by charging them for untested features but fixing the broken ones that have been in the app for more than a year?

Lydiot wrote:The point appears to be taking responsibility for a product that is sold advertising something it doesn't live up to, particularly if getting that corrected requires spending more money.


What do you think is going on with Cubase 7?
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Rotund » Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:03 pm

And may I add Nuendo 6 to that. I think all the things you mention
have been documented...for quite some time now. Cubase 7 and
Nuendo 6 are done deals. (No more development for either)
If you want fixes you will have to upgrade to 7.5.
Oh yea, many of the documented issues are still present in 7.5 along with
some new ones, so maybe wait for version 8.
I'm trialing Cubase 7.5 and just found the "Mute" bug for channel 1.
How in the world...never mind.

If you need a new drum machine, or track versions, or another tape saturation plugin
they have you covered.

For me the new drum machine is almost worth it. Track versions are a convenience
but I prefer to manage alternate takes spread out on tracks.
Never hit a limit with too many tracks...And everything is visible all the time.
Magneto II doesn't have the mojo that the very 1st ever version of Magneto had.
That is obviously just my opinion. I use the UAD Studer, Ampex or Fatso
for those duties anyway.

Steinberg, please focus on your origins. You know Cubase and Nuendo.
Take the time to address the fundamental issues please.

Flickering Cursors, Mixer Key Commands, Mouse wheel malfunctions, etc...
You know what they are.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Rhino » Thu Mar 13, 2014 1:20 am

Rotund wrote:If you want fixes you will have to upgrade to 7.5.

I guess it's more like "no upgrade to Cx.x unless the showstoppers are fixed", ymmv.
Obviously agreed to everything else that's been said before, unfortunately the list is even longer, a lot longer.
Focus problems (the mother of numerous bugs), Kermit aka mixer zoom, Variaudio, totally unfinished implementation of mixer visuals into "mixer view presets" and most of all, into workspaces, there's more.
And it's all central stuff you can't really work around, unless of course you count going back to complete mouse control and forgetting about keycommands, GR and workspaces as a valid alternative, I don't think so. :evil:
Nobody would complain too much about a bug in a plugin or similar, as that would be easy to work around.
ymmv,
Rhino

Damn it, there is no controversy about any of the mentioned issues, none are machine specific, and none are intentional, they are bugs, simple as that, mostly bugs that bite you more the deeper you get into efficient workflow. :?
Come on, Steinberg, accept the obvious, fix all these biggies once and for all and we will live happily ever after. 8-)
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby MrSmith » Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:55 am

Rhino wrote:Come on, Steinberg, accept the obvious, fix all these biggies once and for all and we will live happily ever after. 8-)


Thank you! Isn't the situation very curious? Just look:

    On the one hand: You have a user base pleading for liberation from broken features.

    ...on the other hand: You have a developer that's actively adding content and some fixes, but largely, it's not the content that users want.
Therefore, they must have a motive other than "give the users what they want" :? What could it be?


Whenever serious feature discussion is happening around the boards, this phrase usually comes up:

hopefully it'll be in cubase 8


As users, we are forced to keep our hopes set on this illusion. It's the only solace we have in this situation. Because let's face it: as a purchaser of this software, you have very little recourse (that I'm aware of).

So if you're at least SLIGHTLY invested in Cubase time-wise, you're stuck in a pit with no escape.

They can keep this going forever, actually. Releasing a 70% done app while you hope that the next version addresses the concerns.

I'm not angry at this situation at all: I honestly believe that addressing these concerns would serve the users of this application and allow to have more a more relaxed, efficient experience creating/mixing/designing music in this sandbox.

Am I fair ti ask that our developer meet us halfway and address why they haven't fixed the major issues with this application. In plain, clear English - answers to the progress of rectifying major bugs in the application.

I believe that we're entitled to know if something is being done to address these issues.

We're loyal, paying customers after all.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby iBM » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:57 am

The Cubase 7/7.5 and Nuendo 6/6.5 will go down in history as the worst/most difficult major cycle ever. Steinberg's Vista (and Millenium) springs to mind.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby bugishcompany » Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:28 pm

The entire 7 branch is bug ridden and unrealiable.
Money for .5 was a punch to the balls and few bugs were adressed.
More than 1 year after release the damn mixer still gives headache...

So...I jumped over to rock Reaper, this is my 5th week with their app, and I love it.
They beta test, they fix bugs within a week and they have open discussion with their users.

Everything cubase can do, reaper does faster.

Imagine my surprise to see launch times under 5 seconds...
More than double of available cpu compared to bloatbase.

If reaper crashes you are up and running within 10 seconds...no locked audio driver, good programming.
If C crashes...good luck waiting 15 minutes for the bloated process to release.

After I post this I will be heading for Ebay and sell my C7.5 license.
Good luck people!

P.S
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby SteveInChicago » Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:57 pm

bugishcompany wrote:Everything cubase can do, reaper does faster.
Except for what Reaper doesn't do, of course. :mrgreen:
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Headlands » Thu Mar 13, 2014 11:56 pm

bugishcompany wrote:The entire 7 branch is bug ridden and unrealiable.
Money for .5 was a punch to the balls and few bugs were adressed.
More than 1 year after release the damn mixer still gives headache...

So...I jumped over to rock Reaper, this is my 5th week with their app, and I love it.
They beta test, they fix bugs within a week and they have open discussion with their users.

Everything cubase can do, reaper does faster.

Imagine my surprise to see launch times under 5 seconds...
More than double of available cpu compared to bloatbase.

If reaper crashes you are up and running within 10 seconds...no locked audio driver, good programming.
If C crashes...good luck waiting 15 minutes for the bloated process to release.

After I post this I will be heading for Ebay and sell my C7.5 license.
Good luck people!


I am in the process of auditioning Reaper, Studio One, (already have Pro Tools) and also am very excited to try Bitwig when it comes out. I've been a diehard Cubendo user for about ten years, and am simply too tired of the things that have all been mentioned on this thread. Congrats on making the move -- hope your experience with Reaper is better than the poor support/interaction/speed of Steinberg. I'll also keep Cubase until V 8 and see what happens with Steinberg as a company, but it's not looking good right now.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby shanabit » Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:27 am

Forum police will be here soon, say what you gotta say LOL
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Buchanan » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:49 am

Do they force one to upgrade? Bugs have been there for years? And STILL you buy it?!
I'd have moved on long ago if it was that bad.
In ANY software you care to look at there's ALWAYS bugs that are never getting fixed.
I look at it this way. Cubase has a few thousand functions. And about 20 bugs tops. I just do the math....

(waits for wailing, gnashing of teeth and criticism police) :mrgreen:
Everyone wants perfect software. But nobody's perfect.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby greggybud » Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:23 am

MrSmith wrote:
Rhino wrote:Come on, Steinberg, accept the obvious, fix all these biggies once and for all and we will live happily ever after. 8-)


Thank you! Isn't the situation very curious? Just look:

    On the one hand: You have a user base pleading for liberation from broken features.

    ...on the other hand: You have a developer that's actively adding content and some fixes, but largely, it's not the content that users want.
Therefore, they must have a motive other than "give the users what they want" :? What could it be?


The only thing I can guess is that the things you and I have asked for... (improved workflow, focus key commands, and bug fixes) are not the things that sell new units to new users. What would be appealing to a new user? A cool looking mix console. New and improved Loop Mash. More VSTI's? Chord Tracks. Vari-Audio. Media bay. Another reverb. I'm sure Im missing a few features that have seduced new users into buying 7 or 7.5.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Rhino » Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:40 am

Buchanan wrote:Do they force one to upgrade? Bugs have been there for years? And STILL you buy it?!
I'd have moved on long ago if it was that bad.
In ANY software you care to look at there's ALWAYS bugs that are never getting fixed.
I look at it this way. Cubase has a few thousand functions. And about 20 bugs tops. I just do the math....

Cubase works just fine. However it isn't "genius" proof.


Apparently this thread isn't either.
If you don't experience all these obvious workflow issues, why don't you get back to casual mouse pushing ?
What's your business then in this thread ?
So, back on topic, I typically concentrate on software facts instead of telling other people what they should do or not do, sorry for making this one (necessary) exception here.
ymmv,
Rhino

Not that it would matter, but none of these bugs was part of the official feature list. Starting with SX1, no .0 versions were unusable by any means, despite a few moderate issues I was up and running with the new versions within a week and never had to fall back on the previous version.
Unfortunately C7 changes everything ... :roll:
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Rhino » Fri Mar 14, 2014 8:09 am

greggybud wrote:The only thing I can guess is that the things you and I have asked for... (improved workflow, focus key commands, and bug fixes) are not the things that sell new units to new users. What would be appealing to a new user? A cool looking mix console. New and improved Loop Mash. More VSTI's? Chord Tracks. Vari-Audio. Media bay. Another reverb. I'm sure Im missing a few features that have seduced new users into buying 7 or 7.5.


C7 is different.
All previous Cubase versions had their share of "newbie fodder", but I can't recall any version being released (and ended !) with such an amount of unfinished and plain broken core functionality like 7.
It's not so much about extras we could do without, it's about broken features we can't do without.
Not wanting to contradict you, greggybud, we share a lot of common ground, I just don't accept the above argument, sorry.
This is not an either-or scenario by any means, Steinberg mostly succeeded to find a reasonable balance in the past, which is what made them successful.

Yesterday I made the mistake of setting up 7.5 for a guy I know, imagine his face when he realized most of the visual aspects of the mixer had reset after a reload, next thing Mr Clever tried was saving some workspaces, same desaster more or less, when he learned there is not even a way of transferring the few saveable rudiments to another project I went home and he went back to C6.5.
No, he didn't ask before buying the "upgrade". :cry:

like always, ymmv,
Rhino
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Tajika » Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:30 am

I'll second that, C7.5 still feels unfinished. The upcoming update reflects that: Fixing over 60 issues in a software towards the end of its lifecycle really shouldn't be necessary. C6.5 was definitively more stable at that point.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Rhino » Fri Mar 14, 2014 12:54 pm

Tajika wrote:The upcoming update reflects that: Fixing over 60 issues in a software towards the end of its lifecycle really shouldn't be necessary.

If only that were the problem, none of the biggies mentioned in this thread (which is far from complete) are on the list for 7.5.20 afaics. :evil:
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby iBM » Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:54 pm

Rhino wrote:[I went home and he went back to C6.5. Rhino

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby cmaffia » Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:07 pm

The mix console screen on my multi monitor setup still freezes once or twice a session since I upgraded to 7.5 and it still happens in 7.5.10. The ENTIRE mix console and opened plugins freeze while the project screen and other applications on the other monitors are just fine. To fix it I have to hit F3 (to close) then hit F3 again and it comes back to life. I've reported it in the issues section but no feedback. I've also given up on the BS that plugins hide behind the mixer. It's like Steinberg tests using only plain 1 monitor vanilla setups.

Do they test using 2, 3 or 4 monitors (I use 4)?

Do they hook up 3rd party external hardware as part of their testing or just their own hardware?

Unless Steinberg's adopts a temporary strategy of "STOP ADDING STUFF AND FIX ALL BUGS FIRST", then I believe this might be my last version of Cubase unless things change... and this is coming from someone who was defending their business practice up until a week ago
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Buchanan » Fri Mar 14, 2014 3:11 pm

Rhino wrote:
Buchanan wrote:Do they force one to upgrade? Bugs have been there for years? And STILL you buy it?!
I'd have moved on long ago if it was that bad.
In ANY software you care to look at there's ALWAYS bugs that are never getting fixed.
I look at it this way. Cubase has a few thousand functions. And about 20 bugs tops. I just do the math....

Cubase works just fine. However it isn't "genius" proof.


Apparently this thread isn't either.
If you don't experience all these obvious workflow issues, why don't you get back to casual mouse pushing ?
What's your business then in this thread ?
So, back on topic, I typically concentrate on software facts instead of telling other people what they should do or not do, sorry for making this one (necessary) exception here.
ymmv,
Rhino

Not that it would matter, but none of these bugs was part of the official feature list. Starting with SX1, no .0 versions were unusable by any means, despite a few moderate issues I was up and running with the new versions within a week and never had to fall back on the previous version.
Unfortunately C7 changes everything ... :roll:


My apologies I didn't know you meant special bugs in Cubase 7 exclusively. :mrgreen: Got lost with those OT posts later that mentioned OLD bugs that were still there.
BUT. Where exactly did I tell anyone what to do? Maybe that's why people buy software they don't like and complain about. Because they think Steinberg tells them to. :mrgreen:
Lighten up. (maybe that's telling you what do but what the heck) Most miseryarsed forum on the planet or what? :lol:
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Buchanan » Fri Mar 14, 2014 3:18 pm

cmaffia wrote:The mix console screen on my multi monitor setup still freezes once or twice a session since I upgraded to 7.5 and it still happens in 7.5.10. The ENTIRE mix console and opened plugins freeze while the project screen and other applications on the other monitors are just fine. To fix it I have to hit F3 (to close) then hit F3 again and it comes back to life. I've reported it in the issues section but no feedback. I've also given up on the BS that plugins hide behind the mixer. It's like Steinberg tests using only plain 1 monitor vanilla setups.

Do they test using 2, 3 or 4 monitors (I use 4)?

Do they hook up 3rd party external hardware as part of their testing or just their own hardware?

Unless Steinberg's adopts a temporary strategy of "STOP ADDING STUFF AND FIX ALL BUGS FIRST", then I believe this might be my last version of Cubase unless things change... and this is coming from someone who was defending their business practice up until a week ago


Why are you here with a serious problem like that? You need to contact support. Have you contacted support? Complaining here is USELESS. The general forum is for the odd problem someone else might do you quick fix, bit of user advice etc.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby r.u.sirius » Fri Mar 14, 2014 3:42 pm

sorry Buchanan, but doesn´t it get boring singing the same old song day in day out?
Your snobbist and trolling attitude is a real pain and a punch in the face of the many folks here who take their precious time to point out serious workflow problems and bugs in Cubase 7. Most of the time, there is no bashing and whining involved, but the justified wish to have Cubase improved!
Man, your Mr.-know-it-all motivation stays puzzling....
:roll:
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby cmaffia » Fri Mar 14, 2014 3:43 pm

Buchanan wrote:
cmaffia wrote:The mix console screen on my multi monitor setup still freezes once or twice a session since I upgraded to 7.5 and it still happens in 7.5.10. The ENTIRE mix console and opened plugins freeze while the project screen and other applications on the other monitors are just fine. To fix it I have to hit F3 (to close) then hit F3 again and it comes back to life. I've reported it in the issues section but no feedback. I've also given up on the BS that plugins hide behind the mixer. It's like Steinberg tests using only plain 1 monitor vanilla setups.

Do they test using 2, 3 or 4 monitors (I use 4)?

Do they hook up 3rd party external hardware as part of their testing or just their own hardware?

Unless Steinberg's adopts a temporary strategy of "STOP ADDING STUFF AND FIX ALL BUGS FIRST", then I believe this might be my last version of Cubase unless things change... and this is coming from someone who was defending their business practice up until a week ago


Why are you here with a serious problem like that? You need to contact support. Have you contacted support? Complaining here is USELESS. The general forum is for the odd problem someone else might do you quick fix, bit of user advice etc.


Woah!! Step back Jack! Have you gone lost yo mind??

Do you think this is my first rodeo?

That I don't know how to open up a Steinberg Support ticket?

Who the are you? The almighty sage?

Don't get cheesed off at me because it's contrary to your banal narrative. Also read the entire thread...I am not the only one here echoing chronic issues.

Such brave talk when you have miles of fibre optic cable between you and the recipient of your elitist attitude.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby DenisSalois » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:01 pm

:roll:
What they both said ...
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby MrSmith » Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:18 pm

It's very simple. We deserve an answer to the following question:

    Are the major Cubase 7-7.5 issues outlined in this thread (and countless others) being addressed?
    Specifically: mixer focus, workspace management, and output chain in the channel settings.

    If so: when can we expect an update?


Can a Steinberg representative please address this question? Thank you.
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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby Rotund » Fri Mar 14, 2014 8:55 pm

MrSmith wrote:It's very simple. We deserve an answer to the following question:

    ARE THE MAJOR CUBASE 7-7.5 ISSUES OUTLINED IN THIS THREAD (AND COUNTLESS OTHERS) BEING ADDRESSED?
    SPECIFICALLY: MIXER FOCUS, WORKSPACE MANAGEMENT, AND OUTPUT CHAIN IN THE CHANNEL SETTINGS.

    IF SO: WHEN CAN WE EXPECT AN UPDATE?

Can a Steinberg representative please address this question? Thank you.



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Re: What is going on with Cubase 7?

Postby alexis » Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:24 pm

MrSmith wrote:It's very simple. We deserve an answer to the following question:

    ARE THE]MAJOR CUBASE 7-7.5 ISSUES OUTLINED IN THIS THREAD (AND COUNTLESS OTHERS) BEING ADDRESSED?
    SPECIFICALLY: ... OUTPUT CHAIN IN THE CHANNEL SETTINGS.
...


Can someone help me out please and factually/non-emotionally describe what that refers to ("Output chain ...").

Thanks!
Alexis

One way to get variable-tempo audio to follow a grid here.
- A more detailed explanation for how to get variable-tempo audio to follow a grid here!
- And here for MIDI

Some ways to render virtual instruments to audio here.

Tips Tricks and Workflow Goodness

CubaseTutorial.net - very nice collection of instructional youtubes

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