[ISSUE]Logical Editor- Relative Random: unexpected result

Please use this sub forum to report technical issues and misbehaviors you encounter with Cubase 7
and Cubase Artist 7

[ISSUE]Logical Editor- Relative Random: unexpected result

Postby gph » Sat Jun 14, 2014 11:39 am

===
mod edit: see below for repro viewtopic.php?f=184&t=60861#p366004
==

Hi -

Could anyone help, please?...

I'm trying to humanize some MIDI by introducing some random variance in the position, but without quantizing as some of the music is not to a grid.

I have RTFM, and I have investigated the Logical Editor, and with filter set to Type = Note, and the Transform set to Position / Set relative random values between / -20 / 20.

I was expecting it to move the selected notes randomly +/- 20 PPQs. My project is set to 480 PPQ.

But the notes are jumping huge distances randomly and I can't work out what it's doing. Tried turning off snap to gird in case it was that, but didn't make any difference.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,

Graham

Nuendo + NEK 6.0.7 (same functionality for Logical Editor as Cubase 7 I understand).
Last edited by Guillermo on Wed Jun 18, 2014 9:34 am, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: clarify title and link to repro
gph
Junior Member
 
Posts: 53
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 10:42 pm
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 10 times

Re: How do I humanize without quantizing?

Postby Grim » Sat Jun 14, 2014 1:56 pm

Just tested quickly in Cubase 7.5.2 and works fine here.

Type Is/Equal/Note

Position/Set relative random....\-20/+20
i7 930@2.8, 12Gb, W7HP x64, Cubase 7.5.20 x64, Steinberg UR28M, Alphatrack, Wavelab Elements 7.2.1.
User avatar
Grim
Senior Member
 
Posts: 1571
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:08 pm
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 120 times

Re: How do I humanize without quantizing?

Postby gph » Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:33 pm

Many thanks for taking the time to test, Grim.

I figured out what the issue was - and I don't think this is in the manual...

The track time base must be set to Musical, not Linear. Only then will the parameters be interpreted by the Logical Editor as PPQs.

I have no idea what the parameters represent when in Linear time base but the position transformations are huge in comparison to the PPQs.

Thanks,

Graham
gph
Junior Member
 
Posts: 53
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 10:42 pm
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 10 times

Re: How do I humanize without quantizing?

Postby vic_france » Sat Jun 14, 2014 3:12 pm

I can merely confirm your findings..
I built a simple MIDI Part, and duplicated it to a 2nd MIDI track, but setting that duplicate track to Linear Timebase. Performed the Logical Edit on each Part in turn.. worked fine on the track in Musical Timebase, total chaos on the track in Linear.
(Steve? Don your new green coat! ;) )
Mac Pro Quad-Core 2.66 GHz | 16GB RAM | MOTU PCI-424/2408mk3|MOTU Midi Timepiece AV | Mac OS X 10.9.5 | Cubase 7.5.30| DP 8.0.7| Logic Pro X 10.0.7| ProTools 11.2.1| Ableton Live 9.1.5
User avatar
vic_france
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2327
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:16 pm
Has thanked: 4 times
Been thanked: 127 times

Re: How do I humanize without quantizing?

Postby gph » Sat Jun 14, 2014 4:47 pm

Many thanks for taking the time to do that vic_france.

It sure would be good to understand the behaviour - or if it's a bug, to get it fixed.

Cheers.
gph
Junior Member
 
Posts: 53
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 10:42 pm
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 10 times

Re: Logical Editor- Relative Random: unexpected result

Postby SteveInChicago » Sat Jun 14, 2014 6:08 pm

Indeed, this looks wrong! :lol:

In fact, the value of 1 unit appears, bewilderingly ;), to equal one second, rather than one tick. But what should it equal in linear timebase? One sample? One frame? Some other value derived from what the ruler is set to? Let's see what they say at Steinberg HQ. :geek:

Here's an regulation ;) formated repro to make it official: (Mainly plagiarizing Vic's recipe. :P )

  1. On a track set to Musical Timebase, build a simple MIDI Part with one note, then duplicate it to a 2nd MIDI track
  2. Set that duplicate track to Linear Timebase
  3. Perform a Logical Edit: Position | "Set Relative Random Values" with a values set to 1, 0 on each Part in turn
On the Musical Timebase track it moves note either 1 tick or zero ticks , as expected
On the Linear Timebase track it moves note by one second or zero seconds, resulting in huge moves when the values are set higher.
Cubase 7.5.30 | Mac 10.8.5 | i7-3770k Gigabyte Z77-UD5H | 16gb | TC Konnekt24D
User avatar
SteveInChicago
External Moderator
 
Posts: 4856
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 7:42 pm
Location: Chicago, IL USA
Has thanked: 115 times
Been thanked: 307 times


Return to Issue Reports

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest