One little feature question regarding 7.5.20

Yes, but click on the e-button instead… you then got an extra Control Room in a separate window.

Svenne » 09 Apr 2014 23:54
delta wrote:You can add a dedicated (extra) controlroom in VST connections (F4)

I¨m afraid you’re wrong. What your arrow is pointing at the the Control Room Activation button. Deactivate it and your have no Control Room at all. It does not give you an extra Control Room.

See attach

Delta

Why didn’t you point the arrow at the e-button then?

Anyway, that’s beside the point. I’ve never denied that it is possible to show multiple Control Room/Mixer Panels in extra Mixer windows and/or free-floating windows. This discussion is about Steinbergs implementation of the combined CR/Meter view.

That there are workarounds does not negate the fact that Steinberg screwed up the implementation of this particular feature!

This isn’t the first time Steinbergs developers/programmers has rendered great features unusable by screwing up the implementation, neither. Steinbergs development department would do good to talk to engineers and musicians (i.e. the people who are supposed to use their products in the real world) before implementing new features. I believe it’s called market research, and is used by most manufactures outside software development.



The people developing the app are neither using it professionally nor listening to the users or understanding what they’re asking for.

No surprise here.

The people developing the app are neither using it professionally nor listening to the users or understanding what they’re asking for.

So apply for a job darling. You’re obviously a candidate. Tell them how to do it properly. :mrgreen:
They do have a jobs section on the main site. You go fix Cubase for us poor amateurs who can’t stop Cubase from working. :mrgreen:

I’m not sure that this is completely accurate. There are instances when they do listen. People have been nagging, from day one of the release of CB 7.0, about the option to delete an entry from the “Recent Files” in the the Steinberg Hub. Now, more than a year later, we’ve finally got it!

So, there are occasions when they do listen. But when they do, they take a long, long, long, long, long time to react. :wink:

In a way, your correct. If Steinberg were to put together an advisory panel of people actually using their products, in the real world, and consulted this panel during the design state, something amazing might happen. All the great ideas that the programmers and designers come up with, might actually be usable in the real world. Wouldn’t that be a revolutionary concept?

At least in software development. Other branches has done it for more than a century!

So. We’re all businessmen. You write to Steinberg management suggesting the idea and see if they’re interested. They certainly won’t make any business decisions based on any posts I see here though. They will need a plan and strategy of course plus an idea of the budget involved.
Oh, no. A horrible thought just descended. They don’t actually know how to do programming for music applications!? Horror! And certainly Steinberg’s programmers have never been out of the bedroom for decades! They don’t even listen to music! Cubase is a software design program to make pancakes! Stupid me! :laughing:

Are we? If I were to ignore my customers and adopt an “I don’t-care-what-you-want,-I-know-best” attitude, I guarantee you that any repeat business would dry up in no time. And any new business aswell, as soon as word gets around.

“They certainly won’t make any business decisions based on any posts I see here though”
Well, they ignore the views expressed by their customers (those that keep the company alive) here at their own peril.

“I don’t care what YOU want, I know best…” !? Well who exactly DOES “know best”? I haven’t seen anyone yet. I wasn’t aware that Cubase was a custom built program. MOST companies, Steinberg included, make a product that they know how to make, put it on the market and if it’s total dirt no one buys it. People don’t buy cars to constantly moan about them. They drive. Some might make suggestions but they don’t expect the company to be slave to their every last whim and desire. If the company, for any reason, doesn’t make the colour car they want they get over it and continue driving. They don’t sit in the showroom coffee corner moaning all day.
If the very few customers who complain clearly have NO IDEA about how to make a car (or about basic computing and programming) or the mechanics involved why should the company listen? Nobody
in a business as successful as Steinberg listens to the business plans of those who don’t know what that business (even their own business) involves. You make what you can. It sells or you go out of business. I don’t see Steinberg / Yamaha going out of business just yet. But what’s the point of complaining to a doomed company then?
Every so often, agreed they MUST see a good idea here, by my reckoning, one per decade.
Anyway this forum is a great place to keep serial complainers because no one else in the world sees their comments. :mrgreen: Only the plusone-ers.

If you market a product as being able to do loudness monitoring, then those values should be seen lest the function is useless.

If you modify your product to show more information at the expense of the above then the above is void whenever that condition is in effect. It’s thus either or.

The original poster is right in his criticism (if factually correct), and I am correct in that the design is flawed for that reason. It’s a very simple choice to make regarding the design of the feature; vertical or horizontal, and what are the effects of either.

The basic problem is that the redesign of the CR GUI was dumb. Rather than enhance Cubendo capability by adding the CR “pane” to the traditional mixer view they got rid of the latter at the expense of the former, which to my knowledge not a single user has asked for. They left a traditional, intuitive, internally consistent view of a mixer (which is what the CR is) in favour of this. Not a single person has been able to explain exactly what was gained by that, assuming for a second that less flexibility for viewing and more clicking is not a benefit to the user.

A mixer is a mixer, and should look like a …mixer (as my uncle says). Including the Control Room MIXER (as his nephew says) :wink:

I’m 100% with Lydiot and the OP.
The “other” guy is just picking a fight, in which he can do elsewhere IMO.

On the contrary. A business that does this will go bust pretty soon. MOST businesses spend lots of money on market research before the product goes into the design phase. It’s easy; design a product that lives up to the customers expectations and they will buy it; design one that don’t and they won’t.

This is where Steinberg, unfortunately, falls short. It’s far more work to change the brand of DAW, than the band of pots & pans or car that you use. Despite this, I am sure that Steinbergs neglect of their customers criticisms will impact on their sales, if already has (I don’t have access to their corporate sales figures).

I may sound overly critical to some, but rest assured. I consider Cubase the best DAW out there (which I’m sorry I can’t say about WLE, which a very good example of the mess that is an inevitable result of ignoring your customers).

Cubase is a good product. If they would listen to their customers and get some of the messed up features (VariAudio, Expression Maps, VST Connect, etc.) to work correctly in the real world. It would be an astonishing product.

Except when Steinbergs designers design it, I guess. :wink:

I think that Steinberg do listen to their customers, and we enjoy regular updates as a result. Someone has already posted a means of showing the meter and Control room mixer side by side which I found extremely helpful and is a very suitable solution to the OP’s original query.

After 30 years of use, Cubase as it has become so much a part of my creative life that I have ceased to have an opinion about it. It just is. I invest in the upgrades and constantly discover new features that demonstrate to me that real care and thought has gone into its design over all of that time. And I know that the development team work tirelessly to improve its stability.

I often think there are a group of Cubase forum users who seem to spend their lives “testing” Cubase and howl with joy when they find a supposed problem that I will probably never experience. And you know what? I simply do not care about how this or that inconsequential bug hampers their “workflow” (God how I hate that meaningless word).

I think computers and musicians are not great fellows and a lot of the comment I see here is damning evidence that you cannot necessarily be good at both. Cubase is an incredibly complex programme which I am still learning after all these years. My sole advantage over some here is that I possess the necessary patience with it to get the end result that I want.

“Cubase is the best DAW out there…” (the general quote from some posters who seem to have painted themselves into a corner) So why make it seem like it’s TOTALLY unusable?

There’s only really one reason for that…
Then I have to agree. It’s totally unusable and I shall stop using it forthwith and demand my money back. :laughing:
I have to agree. I have been told. The disagreement police have spoken. :mrgreen:

Look I don’t mind a bit of criticism of Cubase. Many posts are quite valid. But. They are usually well thought out and explained and don’t go on for years scratching the eyes out of anyone who dares to say that they can’t reproduce the problem.
Try doing the tantrum bit for months on the Sound on Sound forum and they’ll laugh all over you. Maybe they already have done which is why you all seem stuck here like old vinyl being scratched by a blunt needle. :mrgreen:
I mean if you can’t use the forum and support desk to handle your complaints properly then I’m sorry but one upshot is any reader (like me) MUST assume that, Cubase being a bit more complicated is… I’ll leave that floating for now. See if you get it.

I suggest that you keep your insulting insinuations to yourself.

I am no fanatic that takes it on himself to defend Steinbergs every action or lack thereof. When Steinberg does something good, I tell them that. When they do something bad, I tell them that. I have praised featured that Steinberg has succeeded in getting right in other discussions. Right now, however, we are discussing instances where they have failed. I have definitely not painted myself into a corner.

You seem to have done so though. People who must resort to insulting remarks and character assassination, has nothing worthwhile left to say, should shut up and let the rest of us continue the discussion in a civil manner.

Right now, however, we are discussing instances where they have failed. I have definitely not painted myself into a corner.

What instances “where they have failed” exactly that affect absolutely everybody? Or just YOU? And if it is that bad why are you not reporting “where they have failed” to the ISSUES forum or to the SUPPORT desk?
If you can’t use the forum and support properly…? What conclusions do you think anyone comes to when YOU use Cubase and “find” a fault? We’re only human. And you aren’t god.
At the moment scouring the forum I find very few in the General forum with any actual disasters happening, just the odd polite enquiry about procedure, maybe the odd criticism of the mixer itself. I see MANY more posts lauding Cubase 7.
If there was much wrong the WHOLE forum would be at gridlock. Not the odd user at gridlock because they don’t read the manual properly or understand what Cubase DOES instead of what they THINK it should do.
And even if Cubase has faults they do not merit the hoohah going on in a couple of dodgy threads.

In which threads you yourself are very “outspoken” I must say.
Keep your breath and stay out of those threads then, if you feel wounded and hurt by others opinions. It’s all opinions anyway, no absolutes.
Peace out :wink:

PS. And let the moderators moderate, as in where to post what. It has always been some crossing of lines here in that regard (and has nothing to do with anyones qualifications as an engineer, producer, mixer, and/or musician).

This has already been answered. If you take the trouble of reading the postings before making your own, you might succeed in not making a fool of yourself. I don’t say it’s possible, but where’s the harm in trying?