Remote Control Editor discussion

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sming
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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by sming » Thu Jan 03, 2013 4:46 pm

Backbeat wrote: As TabSel wrote it is totally disapointing to me.
I am not using the Mackie Control to control Plugin Parameters because it is far to slow.
For example an insert plugin you have to select the insert slot first then turn the pages to search the parameter.
I am much more faster with a mouse to do the same.

Our wishes for Years was a Remote Control Editor with Focused Editor Window control.
That means if a VST Editor Window comes in focus the controls on the controller will follow.
You have to set up the parameters once for every plugin you want specific controls on your hardwarecontroller with the remote control editor.
Why not use the extra Digit of the Mackie Control Assignemt 9Segment Display to have an extra mode for pluginspecific controls you set up in the remote control editor??
Hi Backbeat,

Thanks for your precious comments and constructive suggestions!

It is true that looking for a specific parameters thru the paging workflow could be a painful experience when that param lies at page N. This is exactly one of the purposes of this editor where you can "throw" all the important parameters into the first page (once during the assignment) where you can access them instantly whenever entering the plugin control layer on your Mackie device. This is especially useful when you want to automate those hot params simultaneously with two or more hands.

Yes, a universal quick controls section with a dynamic assignment based on the latest focused VST plugin is indeed a very appealing and convincing concept. We should definitely bring this forward and let's hope that we get the chance to make it real soon. Appreciate that!

I'm sorry but I don't quite understand the following statement:
Why not use the extra Digit of the Mackie Control Assignemt 9Segment Display to have an extra mode for pluginspecific controls you set up in the remote control editor??
Could you elaborate a bit more, please? Thanks.

cheers
SMing
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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by sming » Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:02 pm

cubic13 wrote: ...

1) First, a serious misbehavior which made me think that, at some point, C7 just crashed : right ckicking on a parameter to display the 'Control settings' menu of it makes Remote Control Editor and all Cubase unresponsive : hitting Escape doesn't work, as well as clicking or double-clicking on the menu or elsewhere and the whole Cubase UI is frozen (see the image below). Thankfully, I had the C7 Operation Manual opened so, as a last resort, I clicked on its Windows task bar button then on Cubase one : the 'control settings' menu has disappeared and Cubase was reacting normally again. So, beware of this ! I don't know what is the point of it anyway, as all the parameters displayed in it are also available in the inspector...

...
Thanks for reporting this, cubic13. Appreciate that.

We have confirmed that it is a bug introduced in 7.0.1 thru the maintenance update. (As there was no such problem in the original 7.0.0 release.) We have determined that it is a window focus related issue and a bug report has been filed for this, which shall be resolved soon in the upcoming maintenance updates.

Meanwhile, if applicable, you can use the window focus change trick (Alt + tab) to work-around the unpleasant focus lock problem. Simply focus to any other program and back to Cubase again, either thru the task bar or Alt+Tab. (This applies to any other similar circumstances too whenever this kind of secondary pop up lock takes place).

Thanks!

cheers
SMing
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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by cubic13 » Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:22 pm

sming wrote: Thanks for reporting this, cubic13. Appreciate that.

We have confirmed that it is a bug introduced in 7.0.1 thru the maintenance update. (As there was no such problem in the original 7.0.0 release.) We have determined that it is a window focus related issue and a bug report has been filed for this, which shall be resolved soon in the upcoming maintenance updates.

Meanwhile, if applicable, you can use the window focus change trick (Alt + tab) to work-around the unpleasant focus lock problem. Simply focus to any other program and back to Cubase again, either thru the task bar or Alt+Tab. (This applies to any other similar circumstances too whenever this kind of secondary pop up lock takes place).

Thanks!

cheers
SMing
Great ! I know now that a solution for it is on its way.

Now, as I already reported it, there is another issue more serious, after thinking of it, concerning the layout menu where we can choose one of the four controllers supported : choosing the second one made Cubase crash. I read (I don't remember where, sadly) that the Eucon driver is involved for this one, but I think that, when I installed C7 after receiving the boxed version, I also installed it, just in case. So, I think it's worth a check...
Last edited by cubic13 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by sming » Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:23 pm

cubic13 wrote: Would have liked to but, sadly, not really... The main question remains : as you already set your quick controls for your VSTis and defined your generic remote controllers in the dedicated 'Device setup...' page, at what RCE is useful if you can't link more parameters of the VStis involved to the different buttons, sliders and switches of the latters ?

Again, all my frustration comes that we still have only 8 quick controls at disposal and I was expecting that the RCE could be a kind of extension of them, this while including and be able to manage in just one window all the remote controlled parameters of each VSTi, but I was probably expecting too much...

As it appears to be now, the RCE is useless and, yes, buggy...

At this point, I am considering a feature that I never used : the device panels. But i'm afraid that, beside the tedious work of defining each parameter for each VSTi (and somes have a lot !), they are only usable with external gear and am not sure that you can specify remote devices to control the parameters defined. Will have a further look...
Hi cubic13,

Thanks for the suggestions.
Indeed, some of the discussed ideas of yours and Backbeat (from another thread) are very interesting and useful. IMHO, we should definitely look forward to extend this whenever possible.

As for RCE, it is admittedly an overstatement for what it actually does. Nonetheless, many of our users of the listed devices do benefit a lot from this tiny tool in their daily work, to be honest. We regret that we overlooked the possibility in covering the generic domain too when designing the mentioned feature. In any case, we do hope that we can allocate some resources soon to handle the shaded areas that we have been discussed so far. Thanks again for your constructive comments!

cheers
SMing
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cheers,
SMing

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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by cubic13 » Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:47 pm

sming wrote: Hi cubic13,

Thanks for the suggestions.
Indeed, some of the discussed ideas of yours and Backbeat (from another thread) are very interesting and useful. IMHO, we should definitely look forward to extend this whenever possible.

As for RCE, it is admittedly an overstatement for what it actually does. Nonetheless, many of our users of the listed devices do benefit a lot from this tiny tool in their daily work, to be honest. We regret that we overlooked the possibility in covering the generic domain too when designing the mentioned feature. In any case, we do hope that we can allocate some resources soon to handle the shaded areas that we have been discussed so far. Thanks again for your constructive comments!

cheers
SMing
Thanks for your answer.

As I already stated it, my main frustration comes that we don't have enough quick controls, hence the desperate attempts to use RCE as a replacement. At this point, please let me make two suggestions :

- As the RCE is here and the related code already written, I suggest that the generic remote controllers or any other ones already defined in the 'Device setup' window should be available in the 'layout' menu of the RCE.

- In a more general way, I often blamed Steinberg for not providing us more quick controls, which are really useful and have been a great addition since Cubase 4, if I remember well. The problem is that we don't have enough of them : consider all the parameters needed for a B3 emulation, as an example : drawbars, rotary settings, distorsion, and so on...
Now that RCE exists, why not making it able to create quick contols for all the parameters defined in it ? This would be a kind of integration that would exactly complement the Generic Remote already defined. This way, it would only be necessary to define in the latters only what is strictly Cubase related : all the parameters used for controlling more or less clumsily third party stuff (VSTis, external instruments) would then be defined in the RCE.

Just my two cents...

Thanks again for chiming in, anuway. :)
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Re: Remote control editor: strange knob behaviour

Post by sming » Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:15 pm

Hi jcologne,

which parameter of the Retrologue are you referring to?
I suspect that it is the internal control type of the plugin parameter that causes the observed problem because this seems like a on-off behavior of an on-off type parameter (For instance, this happens when assigning a switch parameter to a physical knob, etc).

Thanks.

cheers
SMing
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cheers,
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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by Rich » Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:57 pm

sming wrote:
________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Rich,

Please allow me to allocate some time to prepare a step-by-step text guide for your use case. Thanks!

cheers
SMing
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Thanks SMing! I appreciate the help :) :)

-Rich

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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by Backbeat » Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:08 am

As for RCE, it is admittedly an overstatement for what it actually does. Nonetheless, many of our users of the listed devices do benefit a lot from this tiny tool in their daily work, to be honest. We regret that we overlooked the possibility in covering the generic domain too when designing the mentioned feature. In any case, we do hope that we can allocate some resources soon to handle the shaded areas that we have been discussed so far. Thanks again for your constructive comments!
Thanks sming for this comments!

cubic13 have you taken a look at my BCR2000 Generic Remote Cubase integration?
There I have some Generic Remote Pages which are for Channel EQ´s or VST Plugins like the UAD Cambridge EQ.
There you have more than 8 Controls (like your Quick Controls) for one VST Plugin.

The main Idea of the Generic Remote is very good.
You cans set up two buttons for switching the Generic Remote Pages Up/Down on the Controller.
Then Cubase sends after switching the GR page the actual parameters to the Controller (for BCR2000 this is for the LED rings that corresponds to the actual values in Cubase).

I´ve been working 2 Years now with my Mackie Control and my BCR 2000 Generic Remote Implementation.
It is a time saver for me, and no other controller has this features (14Bit NRPN Controls with 4 encoder dial speeds).
For the frequency domain of the eqs it is very important to have 14Bit (16383 Steps).
On the Upper Row of the BCR2000 I have 8 Quick Controls in 14Bit too to use this resolution with other vsts.
With the RCE and the Focused Window Switch in combination with Generic Remote it would be a controller dream come true!

Hoping for a better Integration of the RCE in Generic Remote .
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DAW 2: Win 10 Pro 64, i7 2600 , 16GB Ram ,SSD 840EVO 256GB, 2x 2TB HDD , Mackie Control Pro, BCR 2000, FCB 1010 , M-Audio DSM 3 , NS10M , Nubert AW400 Sub ,Maschine Mk1/KK S61 , RME Babyface, Focusrite Saffire Pro 40 , SPL Goldmike , BPM CR73 , AKG Perception 400

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by Backbeat » Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:34 am

I'm sorry but I don't quite understand the following statement:
Why not use the extra Digit of the Mackie Control Assignemt 9Segment Display to have an extra mode for pluginspecific controls you set up in the remote control editor??
Could you elaborate a bit more, please? Thanks.
Thanks sming for your statement!

I try to clarify....
On every Mackie Control there are 2 extra Digits (Assignent on the Display Panel) that are not yet used in the Cubase MCU Implementation.
User should define 2 Buttons on the MCU to control the Assignment on the MCU (for Up/Down of switching between Assignment Pages like Generic Remote Pages).
There you can have the default assignment (normal Cubase MCU Integration) and one or more Assignment Pages.
The Pages can be a Parameterset that can be set up in the Remote Control Editor.
If you Switch the assignment to Assignment Page 1 the Transportcontrols on the MCU are the same , just the Faders and VPots get the Parameterset of the Remote Control Editor Page of the VST Editor that is in Focus.
So you can have an easy access to VST Parameters you once set up for every VST Plugin you use most of the time.
It could be a timesaver!

Here you can see the assignment Digits switched on in tracktion (showing "Pn"):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEhf7WNWGkU
With the extended Remote Control Editor it would be possible to configure Pages for the Mackie C4 to control the VSTs that are in Focus with parameternames.
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DAW 2: Win 10 Pro 64, i7 2600 , 16GB Ram ,SSD 840EVO 256GB, 2x 2TB HDD , Mackie Control Pro, BCR 2000, FCB 1010 , M-Audio DSM 3 , NS10M , Nubert AW400 Sub ,Maschine Mk1/KK S61 , RME Babyface, Focusrite Saffire Pro 40 , SPL Goldmike , BPM CR73 , AKG Perception 400

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cubic13
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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by cubic13 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:36 pm

Backbeat wrote: ...
cubic13 have you taken a look at my BCR2000 Generic Remote Cubase integration?
There I have some Generic Remote Pages which are for Channel EQ´s or VST Plugins like the UAD Cambridge EQ.
There you have more than 8 Controls (like your Quick Controls) for one VST Plugin.

The main Idea of the Generic Remote is very good.
You cans set up two buttons for switching the Generic Remote Pages Up/Down on the Controller.
Then Cubase sends after switching the GR page the actual parameters to the Controller (for BCR2000 this is for the LED rings that corresponds to the actual values in Cubase).

I´ve been working 2 Years now with my Mackie Control and my BCR 2000 Generic Remote Implementation.
It is a time saver for me, and no other controller has this features (14Bit NRPN Controls with 4 encoder dial speeds).
For the frequency domain of the eqs it is very important to have 14Bit (16383 Steps).
On the Upper Row of the BCR2000 I have 8 Quick Controls in 14Bit too to use this resolution with other vsts.
With the RCE and the Focused Window Switch in combination with Generic Remote it would be a controller dream come true!

Hoping for a better Integration of the RCE in Generic Remote .
Hi, Backbeat

I just lookad at your BCR2000 config page. I more or less can see what it is about, even if I'm limited by the german used : seems that indeed you are allowed a lot of things via the Behringer driver. The problem is that I don't have such interface for my 2 controllers, so I'm dependant of what Cubase can offer.

FWIW, here is my problem. In the generic remote definition, I have 2 choices :

1) to dedicate a control to a VST/Mixer/Selected/<VSTi>/<parameter> choosed. Then two problems arise :
- you don't have a view of which control acts on which VSTi/parameter, unless you keep on opening/closing the 'Device setup' window all the time. This alone makes it combersome to use, unless you have a kind of table displayable outside Cubase.
- This solution doesn't work reliably : changing the selected track/VSTi makes the generic remote setup change. In other words, the previous setting defined is sometimes destroyed, sometimes not and often, the displayed parameter controlled is not the actual one.

2) to dedicate a control to a specific VSTi/parameter couple, this is what I do presently, by default. As an example, I set for my first generic remote device (VMK-188+) its 9 faders to CC 21-29, this without assigning them in the second pane. This, because I know that these CC messages are hard coded in VB3 to control the drawbars settings. The problem is that I can only use these faders for VB3, which is rather limiting, as there are no parameters for the other VSTis that can be controlled by these CC messages.

The quick controls allow you to lift these limitations by giving you a clear display of the parameters setted and, most of all, it works reliably when you pass from a VSTi to another. FWIW, I set them as CC 102-109, as I know that they are not used in the MIDI Control Change Messages specifications. Then I set all the parameters needed for each VSTi that I am regularly using. It simply and reliably works... I use the Generic remote devices only for some of Cubase commands (transport, workspaces switch, editors/VSTi windows opening, things like that...).

That's why I keep on asking for much more Quick controls : by experience, I know that only these allow me to perform a efficient remote control of my VSTis. I gave up using the generic remote parameters for this and, guess what ? I started to use my remote controllers for my VSTis only when the Quick controls feature appeared in Cubase 4, I think.

At a point, and it's my bad, I thought that the RCE could act as some kind of extension of the Quick controls feature by allowing us to set more controls defined in the generic remote devices to control other VSTi/parameter couples. From which my frustration and pleading for a more effective integration of the RCE and the quick controls, would it only be for a necessary clarification of all this which truely is becoming an horrible mess.
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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by TabSel » Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:47 pm

just in case any steinberg employee is still following this thread:

extending cubase with proper remote control of plugins:

1) first of all:
a) you can already add multiple generic remote devices. Please extend this with the possibility of renaming generic remote devices. Currently they appear as "generich remote", "generich remote 2" etc. in the devices menu. please allow for custom names.
b) please add the ability to activate/deactivate a generic remote device. currently you have to delete the device and reinsert the device. Save active state of generic remote devices with a project
c) fix the bug: after deleting a generic remote device, it still is available in the devices menu. selecting the menu entry crashes cubase

2) extend the RCE
a) by making (multiple, custom named) generic remote devices available as device in the RCE
b) by adding the possibility to specify the input/output controller data (upper section of a generic remote device) for a plugins' parameter (currently the i/o controller data is hardwired depending on the supported device)

3) extend the plugin header (where currently the A/B button, preset selection lives) by a "RC" and a "lock/auto" toggle button:
a) right click the RC button lets you check one or multiple devices (the devices available in the RCE)
b) left click the unlit RC button activates remote control of the plugin with the devices checked in a) and deactivates remote control of plugins currently remote controlled by the devices checked in a) - light the RC button
c) left click the lit RC button to revert to the remote control binding as it was before b)

d) right click the "lock/auto" button lets you check one or multiple devices (the devices checked with the RC button)
e) left click the unlit "lock" button to lock the checked devices in a) to this plugin. All "unlocked" plugins will follow focus, ie their RC button is automatically "pressed" whenever the plugin window gains focus - light the "lock/auto" button
f) left click the lit "lock/auto" button to unlock the plugin from the devices checked in d)

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by cubic13 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:56 pm

tabsel,

I would differ a little by asking for more quick controls (again...) and their integration in the RCE, this for a more understandable Cubase remote control ability. But you're right : making the Generic remote devices as available ones seems the least to do right now.

So, +1... :)
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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by TabSel » Fri Jan 04, 2013 1:44 pm

Quick Controls are "track based", not plugin based, so Quick Controls and plugin remote controls are two completely different designs.

concerning quick controls: what about a paging mechanism for these?

a) Allow for multiple pages of 8 Quick Controls per track.
b) Show/select QC page in the QC tab in the inspector. (where for example the QC reset button is)
c) add a "next page" and "previous page" control in the Quick Control device (to be bound to a MIDI msg), to rotate between used pages (used page = page with at least one parameter assigned)
d) alter the current "populate parameters" function in the QC tab in the inspector to populate only the 8 slots in the current page with parameters which are not already assigned any QC in any page, or, when <ALT> is held on click, populate the current and all possible subsequent pages with all parameters which aren't already assigned to any QC slot in any previous page)

Thus, fully compatible to the current QC design, easy Quick Controls per select track.

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by Backbeat » Fri Jan 04, 2013 1:49 pm

Tabsel has made a perfect list of requirements.

@cubic13
You have Access to more Quick Controls via the new RCE tabsel wrote about.
The Quick Controls are already in the Generic Remote.
With the mentioned new RCE we are able to configure more Controllers than with the Quick Controls depends on what you set up for each Plugin in the RCE.
Quick Learn function like in the Quick Control Section would be great in new RCE too!
Please extend the new Learn function with the ability to switch automatically to the next controller if one is learned.

Please review the functions in the Generic Remote there are a lot of functions missing, like Controls for the new Channel Strip (HC/LC of Strip EQ, Compressors, Limiters etc....) .
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DAW 2: Win 10 Pro 64, i7 2600 , 16GB Ram ,SSD 840EVO 256GB, 2x 2TB HDD , Mackie Control Pro, BCR 2000, FCB 1010 , M-Audio DSM 3 , NS10M , Nubert AW400 Sub ,Maschine Mk1/KK S61 , RME Babyface, Focusrite Saffire Pro 40 , SPL Goldmike , BPM CR73 , AKG Perception 400

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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by Backbeat » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:05 pm

The generic remote is a diva and you have to get on with it.

I use the selected channel option in the Generic Remote.
If you set up controls for insert-vst´s on one Page (GR Page 1 is for my Channel EQs, GR Page 2 is for Studio EQ on Insert 1) you have to use the same insert slot for what you learned the vst in the GR Page.
If you have for example the studio EQ in Insert 2 of the selected channel it doesen´t work.

But there is a trick.
If you select the channel with Studio EQ on insert 1 and then use drag and drop in the Mixer with Insertview on and put the Studio EQ in another insert slot, you are able to Control the Studio EQ with Generic Remote until you select another Channel.

If you are with VSTinstruments you have to use Instrument tracks and then assign one GR Page to your first 8 Controls of your keyboard and the 2nd Page in Generic Remote for the next 8Controls and so on of the same Plugin.

You just have to figure out how the Generic Remote really works....
DAW 1: Win 7 Ult.64 , i7 5820K 32GB Ram, MB Gigabyte X99 UD3 Bios F6 ,SSD 850 EVO 500GB ,2x 3TB HDD, RME UFX+Remote, Gap Pre 73 Mk2, M-Audio DSM 3, Neumann U87Ai , T.Bone SC450 , Mackie Control Pro, BCR2000 , Kore Controller , FCB1010 , MPK 88 , NI Maschine/KK S61 , Adobe Audition 3 , NI Komplete 11U , jBridge etc.

DAW 2: Win 10 Pro 64, i7 2600 , 16GB Ram ,SSD 840EVO 256GB, 2x 2TB HDD , Mackie Control Pro, BCR 2000, FCB 1010 , M-Audio DSM 3 , NS10M , Nubert AW400 Sub ,Maschine Mk1/KK S61 , RME Babyface, Focusrite Saffire Pro 40 , SPL Goldmike , BPM CR73 , AKG Perception 400

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by cubic13 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:01 pm

TabSel wrote:Quick Controls are "track based", not plugin based, so Quick Controls and plugin remote controls are two completely different designs.

concerning quick controls: what about a paging mechanism for these?

a) Allow for multiple pages of 8 Quick Controls per track.
b) Show/select QC page in the QC tab in the inspector. (where for example the QC reset button is)
c) add a "next page" and "previous page" control in the Quick Control device (to be bound to a MIDI msg), to rotate between used pages (used page = page with at least one parameter assigned)
d) alter the current "populate parameters" function in the QC tab in the inspector to populate only the 8 slots in the current page with parameters which are not already assigned any QC in any page, or, when <ALT> is held on click, populate the current and all possible subsequent pages with all parameters which aren't already assigned to any QC slot in any previous page)

Thus, fully compatible to the current QC design, easy Quick Controls per select track.
Indeed, and I'm prone to forget this aspect... until I make a change of allocation for one of them. At this time, only the parameters of the VSTi loaded appears, with the ones of FX used in the inserts and sends slots. The parameters of the other VSTis are not available. As I'm always making projects starting from a template one where all is already set, VSTi related, it more or less is the same to me. But in a more general way, you're right.

About your suggestion, seems a little complicated. Presently (and from what I've seen before my first C7 crash while I was using it...), in the RCE, you have the VSTi parameters already displayed (up to 48, it seems). I just imagine a button or an option labelled 'transform to Quick controls' in the RCE inspector. By closing the RCE window, you would then have in the 'Quick control' panel of the track inspector a scrollable list of them (that would make up to 48 QC available which would be perfect, IMO).
DAW : i7-870 (HT enabled) - Asus P7-P55D-E - 16 Gb DDR3-1600 - 2 x WD Black Caviar 1 Tb - Radeon 6450 GPU (512 Mb) - Windows 7 Pro SP1 (64) / RME Fireface UCX + Behringer ADA8200
Soft & plug-ins : Cubase 6.5.5 (64), Cubase Pro 9.5.50 & 10.0.30 / Emulator X3 & several VSTis
Gear : Studiologic VMK-188+ / Akai MPD32 / Akai ME30P MIDI Patchbay / Korg 05RW / Roland D110 / Yamaha TX802 / Pre-MIDI stuff.

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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by cubic13 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:07 pm

Backbeat wrote:The generic remote is a diva and you have to get on with it.

I use the selected channel option in the Generic Remote.
If you set up controls for insert-vst´s on one Page (GR Page 1 is for my Channel EQs, GR Page 2 is for Studio EQ on Insert 1) you have to use the same insert slot for what you learned the vst in the GR Page.
If you have for example the studio EQ in Insert 2 of the selected channel it doesen´t work.

But there is a trick.
If you select the channel with Studio EQ on insert 1 and then use drag and drop in the Mixer with Insertview on and put the Studio EQ in another insert slot, you are able to Control the Studio EQ with Generic Remote until you select another Channel.

If you are with VSTinstruments you have to use Instrument tracks and then assign one GR Page to your first 8 Controls of your keyboard and the 2nd Page in Generic Remote for the next 8Controls and so on of the same Plugin.

You just have to figure out how the Generic Remote really works....
Sorry, but I don't get it : what are the 'pages' you are talking about ? Do you mean creating a GRD for each and every group of 8 parameters ? What I have here in the 'Device setup.../'Remote devices' category are three items, no more no less : Generic Remote (VMK-188+ 'device'), Generic Remote 2 (MPD-32 one) and Quick controls. The two formers are each connected to one of the 2 different MIDI input ports that I have available on my E-Mu card.
DAW : i7-870 (HT enabled) - Asus P7-P55D-E - 16 Gb DDR3-1600 - 2 x WD Black Caviar 1 Tb - Radeon 6450 GPU (512 Mb) - Windows 7 Pro SP1 (64) / RME Fireface UCX + Behringer ADA8200
Soft & plug-ins : Cubase 6.5.5 (64), Cubase Pro 9.5.50 & 10.0.30 / Emulator X3 & several VSTis
Gear : Studiologic VMK-188+ / Akai MPD32 / Akai ME30P MIDI Patchbay / Korg 05RW / Roland D110 / Yamaha TX802 / Pre-MIDI stuff.

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by TabSel » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:33 pm

again, Quick Controls are TRACK BASED, even though you can assign ANY parameter of any track or VSTi in the Instrument Rack, anything within the whole project to a quick control. By default, when clicking a QC slot you'll see parameters of VST(i)s of that track. Hit <ctrl> while clicking the slot and you can assign ANY parameter to the QC slot. However, the QCs are still track based, ie active only when the track is selected.

Track Based Quick Controls differ completely from Remote Controlling (focused) VST(s).

Of course, instead of having multiple pages of 8 Quick Controls, the design could be extended to offer a dynamic number of Quick Controls. However, you still only have one physical controller which only controls the current selected track. You'd have to select another track, to control another set of parameters with the one controller.

I personally like the QC the way they are. I have one controller dedicated to a track's Quick Control setup.

But I have other controllers, which might control any plugin anywhere in the project no matter which track is selected.

QC are TRACK based, not plugin based. I don't want to have to select a track in order to control a plugin. I want to select (focus) the plugin, I want to control.

I want to control any number of plugins with different controllers simulateneously, too. So, while an audio track is selected, me controlling the Quick Controls of the selected track with my Pocket Dial, I want to dial in the currently focused StudioEQ settings of any (other) track with my Kore2 controller, following the focused StudioEQ plugin, and controlling one dedicated Retrologue instance with my SL25MkII, no matter which Retrologue instance is focused due to mouse editing...

This is what I understood the RCE was all about: Control a Plugin with any MIDI controller, edit the way this controller interacts with the plugin.

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by cubic13 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:58 pm

TabSel wrote:again, Quick Controls are TRACK BASED, even though you can assign ANY parameter of any track or VSTi in the Instrument Rack, anything within the whole project to a quick control. By default, when clicking a QC slot you'll see parameters of VST(i)s of that track. Hit <ctrl> while clicking the slot and you can assign ANY parameter to the QC slot. However, the QCs are still track based, ie active only when the track is selected.

Track Based Quick Controls differ completely from Remote Controlling (focused) VST(s).

Of course, instead of having multiple pages of 8 Quick Controls, the design could be extended to offer a dynamic number of Quick Controls. However, you still only have one physical controller which only controls the current selected track. You'd have to select another track, to control another set of parameters with the one controller.

I personally like the QC the way they are. I have one controller dedicated to a track's Quick Control setup.

But I have other controllers, which might control any plugin anywhere in the project no matter which track is selected.

QC are TRACK based, not plugin based. I don't want to have to select a track in order to control a plugin. I want to select (focus) the plugin, I want to control.

I want to control any number of plugins with different controllers simulateneously, too. So, while an audio track is selected, me controlling the Quick Controls of the selected track with my Pocket Dial, I want to dial in the currently focused StudioEQ settings of any (other) track with my Kore2 controller, following the focused StudioEQ plugin, and controlling one dedicated Retrologue instance with my SL25MkII, no matter which Retrologue instance is focused due to mouse editing...

This is what I understood the RCE was all about: Control a Plugin with any MIDI controller, edit the way this controller interacts with the plugin.
1) Understood, I already acknowledged it in my previous post...

2) Thanks, cause here, I just learned something... :oops: But as you said, QC are track based, so I don't see the usefulness of such a possibility, which is rather confusing, I think : selecting, say, Mr Ray piano track to control the rotary speed of the VB3 organ emulation, well... :?

3) Here, it is clear that we don't work the same way. I much prefer selecting a track to control what is in it. I see how it can be useful for you, but well, for the most part, I work on little projects and I nearly always have all the tracks showed at a single glance in the mixer when maximized so, clicking on a track and adjusting isn't a problem. With a big project, involving a lot of plug-ins, I don't know how you manage to remember which plug-in/parameter is controlled by which control of which ndevice. But to each his own...

4) This is what I understood also. Sadly, it's not the case, at its present state...

Just hope now that Steiny will clarify the RCE situation and make it usable and compatible with what is already existing.

Cheers,
DAW : i7-870 (HT enabled) - Asus P7-P55D-E - 16 Gb DDR3-1600 - 2 x WD Black Caviar 1 Tb - Radeon 6450 GPU (512 Mb) - Windows 7 Pro SP1 (64) / RME Fireface UCX + Behringer ADA8200
Soft & plug-ins : Cubase 6.5.5 (64), Cubase Pro 9.5.50 & 10.0.30 / Emulator X3 & several VSTis
Gear : Studiologic VMK-188+ / Akai MPD32 / Akai ME30P MIDI Patchbay / Korg 05RW / Roland D110 / Yamaha TX802 / Pre-MIDI stuff.

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by sming » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:05 pm

Hi Rich and other respectable users,

I have prepared and posted the "Step-by-step guide" in a new thread for an easier reading, as it also gives us a new space for the related Q&A later.

So, for those who use the listed hardware and is looking for a "step-by-step" guide to get his hands on, please refer to the following thread, thanks.
https://www.steinberg.net/forum/viewtop ... 81&t=32539

If any of you find it useful and have the time to make a video guide out of it, you are most welcomed! Presumably, you would get a lot of view click ;-)

Thanks
Last edited by sming on Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
cheers,
SMing

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Re: Mackie control and remote control editor?

Post by sming » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:08 pm

Hi there,

Just in case if some of you are still wondering how to make it work for your Mackie MCU and co. Please kindly refer to the new thread that I just posted. Hope that this helps and clarifies the unanswered questions so far.
Thanks!

https://www.steinberg.net/forum/viewtop ... 81&t=32539
Last edited by sming on Thu Apr 11, 2013 11:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
cheers,
SMing

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by -steve- » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:12 pm

sming wrote:Hi Rich and other respectable users
I am not necessarily respectable. My I assume you address me in spite of that? :mrgreen: :roll:

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Re: Remote Control Editor : buggy and useless...

Post by sming » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:13 pm

Hi there,

Just a short note. In case you are wondering how to get the most out of the RCE for the supported HW. Please refer to the step-by-step intro guide that I just prepared. Thanks.

https://www.steinberg.net/forum/viewtop ... 81&t=32539
Last edited by sming on Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
cheers,
SMing

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Re: Remote Controller Editor

Post by sming » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:20 pm

Well... I respect everyone :lol:
(so, surely I hope the same in return :P )
cheers,
SMing

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Re: Step-By-Step Guide for using the Remote Control Editor

Post by cubic13 » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:29 pm

Hi, Sming

Thanks for this welcomed addition.

But, though I can see more clearly now the usefulness of the RCE for owners of a more or less MCU compatible controller, with bidirectional data transmission, AFAICS, it is useless for users such as me who don't have such a device.

Thanks for confirming...
DAW : i7-870 (HT enabled) - Asus P7-P55D-E - 16 Gb DDR3-1600 - 2 x WD Black Caviar 1 Tb - Radeon 6450 GPU (512 Mb) - Windows 7 Pro SP1 (64) / RME Fireface UCX + Behringer ADA8200
Soft & plug-ins : Cubase 6.5.5 (64), Cubase Pro 9.5.50 & 10.0.30 / Emulator X3 & several VSTis
Gear : Studiologic VMK-188+ / Akai MPD32 / Akai ME30P MIDI Patchbay / Korg 05RW / Roland D110 / Yamaha TX802 / Pre-MIDI stuff.

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