NEK is still there?

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NEK is still there?

Post by zvenx » Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:15 pm

seriously?
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Breeze » Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:07 pm

Yep! It's funny looking at the differences between the two introductory videos. The emotional (no jacket) content of the Cubase 7 presentation vs the serious (with jacket) presentation of Nuendo 7 clearly demonstrates the business post-production drums that Yamaha/Steinberg are still beating for Nuendo. The hardware integration is going to help all markets, not just the post-production market, although the post-prod sector typically has more money to invest in these luxuries and is a more lucrative sector to break into and maintain.

Apart from the ADR specific addons, everything else I'm seeing is still valuable to both production sectors and the fact that NEK only requires an unlock is a major step forward. At least that way it's already integrated into the code and updates will have to follow in parallel. I think that's a smart move.

I personally still disagree with the division between post and music that Y/S is so desperate to have these industries adopt with respect to Cubase and Nuendo as many of us obviously dip into both waters on a regular basis. IMO, today's sound landscape is a lot more varied than it used to be: it's more about "audio media" production than "music" or "post". So for us "audio chameleons" with all the varied jobs we get, only the most complete and flexible work environment will do.

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:34 pm

True, the one and only post or music studio does not really exist anymore....

...on the other hand they need to sell to different markets (low/mid/high end) and since both products are now basically released at almost the same time, the problem that the top product misses some of the best new features from the mid priced product is eliminated.
So they actually listened and improved the situation, I believe.

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by indiescore » Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:55 am

I wonder why its not the other way around with NEK, say Cubase 7 is the staple, and then if you need to go heavy post you pay for robust post bells and whistles via NEK , not the Cubase music features - I think PT does it this way, don't you pay extra for video sync tools or they had a production upgrade kit of some sort................ :idea:

I think the mixers look the same now, which is good.

Overall this is a huge leap forward, and exciting.

Also TOUCH OSC app with iPad might work well with the new remote feature.
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Breeze » Thu Nov 15, 2012 5:44 am

indiescore wrote:I wonder why its not the other way around with NEK, say Cubase 7 is the staple, and then if you need to go heavy post you pay for robust post bells and whistles via NEK , not the Cubase music features - I think PT does it this way, don't you pay extra for video sync tools or they had a production upgrade kit of some sort...
IIRC, at one point this was being discussed. It sure would make a lot of sense to have a flagship product and then pick and chose the features you need and unlock them by purchasing the appropriate licenses. You could then add to your arsenal as need and/or budget required. I think that would be a win-win for everyone. A good idea worth considering: it seems to work for the iOS crowd!

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Brendan Woithe » Thu Nov 15, 2012 6:44 am

Correct me if I'm wrong....

But wasn't there "official" statements from steinberg saying that there would NOT be NEK with Nuendo 6?

.......
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Breeze » Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:13 pm

Brendan Woithe wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong....

But wasn't there "official" statements from steinberg saying that there would NOT be NEK with Nuendo 6?

.......
Well, technically there isn't because there's no separate package, but there is because you have to pay to unlock it. So technically you can't accuse them of a total lie in this case... ;)

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Thu Nov 15, 2012 3:11 pm

Well, I really don't see the problem:

You want all features, you buy Nuendo + NEK (or logic or whatever you prefer)
You want only post features, you buy Nuendo
You want only music features, you buy Cubase

This was annoying when you paid for N+NEK and still the Cubase users would get the latest stuff and you had to wait, but now I really don't think it's a problem anymore. If you consider it too expensive (it its a LOT of money) you can still buy something else.

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Everybody's got a NECK

Post by Big K » Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:33 pm

Dejavu... ?? Has there been a similar topic in the past ???
Hmmm ...
Naahhhh... can't be.

Please, no huge dicussion anymore because of a 300 dollar addon.
Need it? Buy it... Better buy it, anyway. The day comes when you gonna need it.

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Re: Everybody's got a NECK

Post by Vocalpoint » Thu Nov 15, 2012 5:04 pm

Bredo wrote:If they had forced it on everybody (without telling ;-)), they maybe could have charged 100 dollars extra instead of your 300 (included in the update).
Well - they are "forcing" those who do not want NEK at all to still install it (as I understand it) - even tho they will never use it. So - a bit of wasted space but still a half baked effort.

Regardless of how Steiny sees it - for the price of Nuendo to the new user (or any of us for that matter) - NEK should just be gone (as a label or module or whatever) and ALL the tools should just be there - included with the cost of one's VERY expensive Nuendo license.

This nickel and dime-ing at the high end of the cost spectrum is ridiculous.

VP
Last edited by Vocalpoint on Thu Nov 15, 2012 6:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Everybody's got a NECK

Post by zvenx » Fri Nov 16, 2012 1:20 am

Bredo wrote:
Vocalpoint wrote:
Bredo wrote:If they had forced it on everybody (without telling ;-)), they maybe could have charged 100 dollars extra instead of your 300 (included in the update).
Well - they are "forcing" those who do want NEK at all to still install it (as I understand it) - even tho they will never use it. So - a bit of wasted space but still a half baked effort.

Regardless of how Steiny sees it - for the price of Nuendo to the new user (or any of us for that matter) - NEK should just be gone (as a label or module or whatever) and ALL the tools should just be there - included with the cost of one's VERY expensive Nuendo license.

This nickel and dime-ing at the high end of the cost spectrum is ridiculous.

VP
Totally agree.
perfectly said too.

rsp
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Re: Everybody's got a NECK

Post by TechBytes » Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:04 pm

Vocalpoint wrote:Regardless of how Steiny sees it - for the price of Nuendo to the new user (or any of us for that matter) - NEK should just be gone (as a label or module or whatever) and ALL the tools should just be there - included with the cost of one's VERY expensive Nuendo license.

This nickel and dime-ing at the high end of the cost spectrum is ridiculous.
+1,

With the price of admission it should never have even been an option in the first place , IMO it was and still is simply some ill conceived market floss to try and project Nuendo as being more "Post" by disabling some "Music" related content.

That N6 now actually installs all the content regardless hints that NEK was to be pulled but the marketing / bean counters kicked in again... :-(

When Nuendo first landed the price variable between it and Cubase was around double the cost from memory , locally sans NEK its now just under 4 x , NEK tips well over 4 x. It just doesn't make any sense in the current economic climate ( or any ) , but its is what it is.

Question is who really cares outside of the immediate and shrinking circle ?

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Rotund » Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:27 pm

+1000000
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Big K » Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:37 am

Whose circle is shrinking?
Can't see that....

NEK was an unlucky decision, but it is so unimportant that the question
of the color of my shoe insoles become worldshaking against it.

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by AlexBell » Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:21 pm

If you using Nuendo to make money, the investment is peanuts regardless of NEK compared to what you get from it.

If you're using it for a hobby I can see how you'd complain but that's it.

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by MattiasNYC » Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:13 pm

Bredo wrote:
AlexBell wrote:If you using Nuendo to make money, the investment is peanuts regardless of NEK compared to what you get from it.

If you're using it for a hobby I can see how you'd complain but that's it.
On my part is not about the money. It's about the clumsy way Steinberg has managed the whole NEK thing from the beginning.
From my post above, I read it as it was free for those already using NEK with N4 and/or N5 (I do). Can anyone confirm?
They still have it as a separate paid license I think Timo said.
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Domilik » Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:10 pm

Does this mean upgrading to Nek 6 will be free if we already own Nek 4 or 5?
That would be fair for me! If Steinberg wants to make some more money and selling music-features to nuendo-license-owners, they should do it, but only once.
(btw in former times I thought Nuendo is that much more expensive than Cubase, because we're getting Cubase + Postfeatures, and not Cubase - Musicfeatures + Postfeatures)

I used the score-editor in N3 quiete extensive, just for printing some score-sheets for fast playing on piano, no need for a detailed fine layout. So I bought the NEK4 for having this advantages still in N4.

When upgrading to N5, I could not believe, that my score-functionality was gone again, and I should pay for this once more.

So I invested into Sibelius. Once. And into some new third-party-synths. Once. And I can still use them in times of N6. Without buying a NEK. So I'm out anyway.
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by MattiasNYC » Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:29 pm

Here's what Timo said:
TimoWildenhain wrote:Hello,

the update costs for the NEK update (e.g. Nuendo 5 + NEK to Nuendo 6 + NEK will be slightly higher
then for the non-NEK update.
The update-paths are basically identical with the current structure.
The good news is: it will be cheaper than it is now. The pricing structure will be announced soon.

Thanks,
Timo
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by MattiasNYC » Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:33 pm

Domilik wrote:When upgrading to N5, I could not believe, that my score-functionality was gone again, and I should pay for this once more.
That's a pretty silly argument if you think about it though, no offense. ANY feature that is the same as the previous version is a feature you "should pay for" "once more", right?

They can charge $250+150 for Nuendo + NEK upgrade in which score is a part, meaning you pay "once more", or

They can charge $400 for an all-inclusive upgrade in which score is a part, meaning you still paid "once more".
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Fredo » Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:50 pm

I think you can try to use your old NEK .... (not sure though)
But you will miss all of the enhancements and additions that the NEK has recieved since then.
And very probably, there will be some incompatibilities too...

I really don't get it why people *still* -after it had been explained a thousand times- want to misunderstand this whole thing. Without the NEK (and referirng to the old system), the price and upgrade price of Nuendo would be the same as Nuendo + NEK. The combination of both has not become more expensive, they just have been separated from each other, resulting in a cheaper solution for those who don't want/need the NEK.
These are the facts, the rest are politics.

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by trancestate » Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:48 pm

it was ill-conceived when it was introduced, it still is ill-conceived. The arguments for it seem ridiculously petty compared to the confusion and bad taste the whole thing stirs up.

There was a promise it would be done away with,that seems now to be just BS. This is a poor start to what seemed like a great new start from Steinberg.

We are all different, but "I" don't "get" why there are some that still try to justify this shambles.

Just as a note, I'm pretty sure the code was always in there and the NEK box and installation dvd were always just for distribution purposes as there was no download option

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by Bassman » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:38 pm

First … NEK was a bad decision from SB, ok ... but the child is now fallen into the fountain.

I think the last Nuendo Update + NEK cost 400 Euros. Without NEK 300 Euros. Now the people cry, who must pay the extra money for NEK. If the NEK would be included, the people would cry, who don’t need it and must pay for it.

My suggestion: SB should make the price in the middle (350 Euros) and make one full Version with included NEK. All have the same Version. NEK user pay 50 bucks fewer and are happy and NO-NEK user pay 50 bucks more and will not die by this. The HD space is the same anyway and SB make not minus.

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by MattiasNYC » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:55 pm

sigh...

So fine, they did it again. How does this change anything for the end user?
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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by trancestate » Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:07 pm

Lydiot wrote:sigh...

So fine, they did it again. How does this change anything for the end user?
there's still time for Steinberg to come to their senses :D

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Re: NEK is still there?

Post by TechBytes » Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:37 pm

Big K wrote:Whose circle is shrinking?
Can't see that....
Thats only because being in the shrinking circle you are getting jammed up way too close to those few remaining , those of us outside the circle can see a bit more clearly...

:lol:

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