Another export audio mixdown issue

Post general topics related to Nuendo 6 here.
User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:51 pm

I did a mixdown last night of a song created in N5 and made some tweaks in N6. I could not get a real-time mixdown without a drive is not fast enough error. I tried disabling a bunch of unnecessary tracks and still could not get it to work. Then I tried an offline mixdown and it worked but I got at least one drop-out of a track (vocal for 1/2 second).
I redid the song this morning in N5 and everything is working as it should and I didn't disable any tracks.

It is a big project (300 + tracks) and the drive has always been on the edge but it has always been workable. Clearly there is something going on where the efficiency of drive use has gone down. This looks like a bug to me.

Also does drive speed really matter when doing offline mixdowns? I didn't receive any error messages. This looks like an other bug.

Dean
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

riwe
Junior Member
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:11 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by riwe » Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:04 pm

I had this also 2 times. I got this error because of the destiniation drive of the mixdown, which was a network drive. When I closed nuendo and restarted it, the export worked without any issues. It works always when I do the export to a fast drive.

But you are right, this seems to be another bug. Why the drive speed matters when I do an offline export?
N 6.5.35 (32Bit & 64Bit) + NEK | WL 8.5.20 (64Bit) | W7 Pro x64 | 16 GB RAM | RME HDSP MADI | RME Firefcae 800 | UAD-2

Big-L
New Member
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:47 am
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Big-L » Mon Mar 25, 2013 8:22 pm

  • I'm having issues playing and exporting (small) files, I can see Nuendo 6 giving spikes on the disk meter! Same project on Nuendo 5.5.4 no disk issues whatsoever.

User avatar
MattiasNYC
Grand Senior Member
Posts: 3829
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 9:27 am
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by MattiasNYC » Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:37 pm

Perhaps the internal routing or something is more complex and makes disk access more of a sensitive matter.

300 tracks on a drive that's been on the edge though? I wouldn't expect that to work on any system.
Nuendo 7.1.4 / Lynx TWO-B / Windows 10 Pro 64-bit / Ryzen 1700 3.7GHz (oc) / 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4@3200MHz / Nvidia GTX 660 / ASUS x370-A mobo/ 500GB WD Blue system drive / Crucial BX100 250GB SSD media / spinners for library/backup ::::: iZotope RX / Phoenixverb Surround / DaVinci Resolve / Faderport / Applied Acoustics UltraAnalog / my pet pony Frank

User avatar
Big K
Member
Posts: 579
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 7:55 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Big K » Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:02 am

It has always been critical to run a drive o.t.e.
I consider anything close to 80 % as unreliable.
If a faster drive is not obtainable and the amount of tracks/data cannot be deminished
a SSD drive might do the trick, although I personally do not yet recommend those.
Could you split the files on 2 drives?

Big K

Do you hear those spikes, a tall?
Nuendo 10, WaveLab 9.5, RME, UAD, PoCo, Win10/64 bit, PC i7 3930K, 16GB RAM, Intensity Pro, Melodyne, Spectrasonics, VSL, All Brainworx & PA, Genelec 1031 for 5.1, Quested HQ 210, NS10s, sevaW lla, LAWO, Neumanns, Brauners, Sennheisers, Schoeps, Sony DASH3324S, 42 RUs of classic hardware, professionally build and designed studio acoustics. SB-User since Cubase 2.0, Nuendo 1.5 ...

Big-L
New Member
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:47 am
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Big-L » Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:52 am

See my other post on SATA 3, I'm having issues playing back small (few seconds) files from a SATA 3 disk (just one track), while it plays fine from a USB 2.0 disk??!!
This is in Nuendo 6 only!

riwe
Junior Member
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:11 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by riwe » Tue Mar 26, 2013 10:45 am

Big-L wrote:See my other post on SATA 3, I'm having issues playing back small (few seconds) files from a SATA 3 disk (just one track), while it plays fine from a USB 2.0 disk??!!
This is in Nuendo 6 only!
In 32 or 64 Bit? This seems to be a SATA3 driver issue.
N 6.5.35 (32Bit & 64Bit) + NEK | WL 8.5.20 (64Bit) | W7 Pro x64 | 16 GB RAM | RME HDSP MADI | RME Firefcae 800 | UAD-2

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:25 am

This problem was not fixed in 6.03. It is not an issue of hard drive speed (as was alluded in an earlier reply) as it worked fine in N5.5 with the same project even before I disabled a bunch of unecessary tracks.

N6 is doing something that is making a mess of hard drive speed. Out of 3 projects that were fine in N5.5, 2 of them will not allow a realtime mixdown without a disk error message in N6.

I consider this a major bug. Please look into this Steinberg.

Thanks

Dean
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

User avatar
MattiasNYC
Grand Senior Member
Posts: 3829
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 9:27 am
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by MattiasNYC » Thu Mar 28, 2013 1:06 am

I apologize for being a contrarian, but I'm not sure I'd be ready to blame SB for a significant upgrade where a project with 300 tracks (which is what we in the industry refer to in technical terms as "a f-n sh-tload of tracks) has trouble playing back on a drive which was on the edge of functioning even before the upgrade.

Every single time I do a significant DAW upgrade I fully anticipate that I may have to upgrade or at least "clean" my computer.

No harm meant by having this for now differing opinion. I love you. :P
Nuendo 7.1.4 / Lynx TWO-B / Windows 10 Pro 64-bit / Ryzen 1700 3.7GHz (oc) / 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4@3200MHz / Nvidia GTX 660 / ASUS x370-A mobo/ 500GB WD Blue system drive / Crucial BX100 250GB SSD media / spinners for library/backup ::::: iZotope RX / Phoenixverb Surround / DaVinci Resolve / Faderport / Applied Acoustics UltraAnalog / my pet pony Frank

TimoWildenhain
Moderator
Posts: 962
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:51 am
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by TimoWildenhain » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:59 am

Rickard wrote:This problem was not fixed in 6.03. It is not an issue of hard drive speed (as was alluded in an earlier reply) as it worked fine in N5.5 with the same project even before I disabled a bunch of unecessary tracks.

N6 is doing something that is making a mess of hard drive speed. Out of 3 projects that were fine in N5.5, 2 of them will not allow a realtime mixdown without a disk error message in N6.

I consider this a major bug. Please look into this Steinberg.

Thanks

Dean
Hello Dean,

ok, we'll check this.

Thanks,
Timo
Timo Wildenhain - Head of Business Unit
Professional Audio Unit
Steinberg Media Technologies GmbH
Hamburg, Germany
Checkout Steinberg on YouTube, Twitter, Facebook and MySpace!

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Thu Mar 28, 2013 6:34 pm

Thanks Timo, it is appreciated.

Hi Lydiot

I don't mind at all suggestions for looking at alternative solutions. In this case I'm looking at an apples to apples comparison with the only difference being N5.5 and N6. I even gave N6 an advantage by disabling around a dozen stereo tracks that N5.5 didn't have a problem with. Yes I would see the HD meter spike in N5.5 when relocating in the project (N6 does the same thing) but it would play apparently glitch free in both programs after the drive caught up. But realtime mixdown would create the drive error message in N6 that was not a problem in N5.5.

And I love you too!

Dean
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

Darren The Musical
Junior Member
Posts: 92
Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2010 11:27 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Darren The Musical » Thu Mar 28, 2013 6:44 pm

Just wondering, when you say it's 300 tracks, is that 300 audio files playing at one time or is it 300 tracks have been created with audio files running at various places throughout?

Thanks!

Darren "More Tracks Is Not Enough" Ingram
Mac 10.11.6 | Win 10 | N8.1 | MOTU Mach 5 v3.2.1 | Vienna Instruments Pro 2 | UR824 with 2.1.0 Firmware and 1.8.5 USB Driver | MIR Pro | 2 x ASUS VW266H monitors | 2 x HannsG monitors | Mac Pro Trashcan 8 Core named Thor | UAD2 Quad | 64 gigs RAM | Logitech G15 keyboard with 18 x 3 programmable keys | 3 x Genelec 1031A monitors | 3 x Dragonfly mics | 2 x AKG C214 mics | EV RE 20 mic | SL 880 Pro key controller | Lemur Software and iPad3 | liters upon liters of Diet Mt Dew | Wii addiction

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Sat Mar 30, 2013 6:52 pm

At any given time it would be a little over 100 tracks actually playing. As I experiment further I am finding that even with offline mixdowns I am still getting drop-outs of certain tracks. I don't hear drop-outs when I am working on the project (except when I initially move the cursor). This is an unworkable situation because I can't hear a live mixdown and I can't trust an offline mixdown. Back to N5.5 :cry:
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:17 pm

I tried a mixdown for another song today and am still having the hard drive overload error for a real time mixdown. Out of six songs attempted, only two allowed an online (realtime) mixdown. I haven't listened yet to see if the offline mixdown has any errors.

Dean
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

User avatar
Chewy Papadopoulos
Member
Posts: 777
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 7:37 pm
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Chewy Papadopoulos » Fri Apr 05, 2013 9:13 pm

For what it's worth, I was having the same sort of problem... was driving me crazy until I ran a surface scan on the disk and came up with a bunch of bad blocks that weren't showing up in DiskWarrior or any other utilities. Replacing the drive!

Chewy
N10x, C8, Cubasis, Halion, UAD-2s (Quad PCI, Satellite & SOLO/Laptop), Fireface 800, UR-22, MC Control, MacPro 12 core 3.46GHz, 64 Gigs RAM OS 10.14.4; MacBook Pro 4 core, 16 Gigs, OS 10.13.6

Wheels
Junior Member
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2010 4:55 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Wheels » Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:01 pm

Richard,
Have you tried turning off (or on) the ASIO-Guard on the VST Audio System Page?
Is Multi Processing checked?
John "Wheels" Hurlbut

Nuendo 10 + PT 10 & 11.Win 10 Pro PC, i9 12 Core CPU, 64 Gig Ram, Dangerous Source Monitor Controller, SSL Nucleus Console. Waves and UAD II Plug-ins etc. Adobe Creative Cloud.

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:36 pm

OK, I did some more testing of this problem. The glitch that was on the offline mixdown happens at the same time the disk error occurs on the realtime mixdown. I tried muting the track that glitch was happening on and was able to do a realtime mixdown. The track that I muted was a vocal track that had a ton of lanes or playlists (dozens).

My theory: I think that N6 may be trying to read, from the hard drive, all of the tracks in playlist at the same time instead of reading only the part that is in focus. Of course only the track that is in focus is heard.

Is this a possibility Steinberg?

BTW I have tried playing with ASIO guard to no avail and I have always been using multiprocessing.

Again, tracks will render fine in N5.5 (and earlier) so I don't believe that it is a hardware issue.

Thanks

Dean
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Tue Apr 09, 2013 6:34 pm

Anybody?
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

User avatar
MattiasNYC
Grand Senior Member
Posts: 3829
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 9:27 am
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by MattiasNYC » Tue Apr 09, 2013 6:51 pm

Rickard wrote:Anybody?
Well, if your last hunch is what you want a comment on then obviously Steinberg is the one to ask. Let's see how well that works out...
Nuendo 7.1.4 / Lynx TWO-B / Windows 10 Pro 64-bit / Ryzen 1700 3.7GHz (oc) / 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4@3200MHz / Nvidia GTX 660 / ASUS x370-A mobo/ 500GB WD Blue system drive / Crucial BX100 250GB SSD media / spinners for library/backup ::::: iZotope RX / Phoenixverb Surround / DaVinci Resolve / Faderport / Applied Acoustics UltraAnalog / my pet pony Frank

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:37 pm

Yes, definitely looking for a Steinberg response!

Dean
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

riwe
Junior Member
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:11 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by riwe » Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:22 am

I can reproduce this error if I open a project, close it and open another project. When I then want to export the second project with realtime-export I receive alternately the harddisk-error which says that the harddisk is too slow and a "cpu overload" error. When I start Nuendo, load the same (second) project and do a realtime-export with this project, it works.
It doesn't matter, if I export to a network- or a local drive.

BTW It would be nice to see some reaction from SB.
N 6.5.35 (32Bit & 64Bit) + NEK | WL 8.5.20 (64Bit) | W7 Pro x64 | 16 GB RAM | RME HDSP MADI | RME Firefcae 800 | UAD-2

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:13 pm

Interesting. I haven't been getting CPU error messages when exporting. I have been needing to close Nuendo and open it fresh when moving from project to project because Jbridge crashes otherwise (I'm only using 64bit). This was happening in 5.5 as well so it is a habit for me to close Nuendo before opening another project.

Dean
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

riwe
Junior Member
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:11 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by riwe » Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:29 pm

I also use N6 x64 with jBridge (although most of the plugins are now 64 bit), but with jBridge I have no issues. These errors also occur when I do not use any 32Bit plugin via jBridge.
BTW my cpu is a i7-3770.
N 6.5.35 (32Bit & 64Bit) + NEK | WL 8.5.20 (64Bit) | W7 Pro x64 | 16 GB RAM | RME HDSP MADI | RME Firefcae 800 | UAD-2

User avatar
Rickard
Member
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by Rickard » Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:30 pm

I did an experiment where I copied the track, deleted all but the clips that needed to play, then disabled the copy. I still get the hard drive not fast enough error that N5.5 does not give me running the same project. So it is not an issue of all clips being read in a multiple lane track.

I upgraded to a slightly faster drive that still gives me the error. And I also still get a glitch with offline mixdowns. It still appears to me that something happened with the efficiency of drive access in N6.

Dean
Win10|i7|16gig ram|Orion 32+ with Madiface USB|N10|PT10 HD|UAD Quad x2| UM-3EX|Midex 8|Mackie Control + 2 extenders|too many mics and preamps to list

TimoWildenhain
Moderator
Posts: 962
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:51 am
Contact:

Re: Another export audio mixdown issue

Post by TimoWildenhain » Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:02 pm

Hi Dean,

unfortunately our team couldn't reproduce the issue described in a short test. However, we believe this is heavily depending on the respective hard disk used (hard disk speed). Naturally, with each major update adding functionality to the code basis, also the requirements on the computer system slightly increases.

Do you still encounter this problem with the new hard drive? Please let me know.

Thanks,
Timo
Timo Wildenhain - Head of Business Unit
Professional Audio Unit
Steinberg Media Technologies GmbH
Hamburg, Germany
Checkout Steinberg on YouTube, Twitter, Facebook and MySpace!

Post Reply

Return to “General”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests