Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

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Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by Nuieve » Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:05 pm

Had i5-4690 with some budget very slow RAM...

Now have Ryzen 3600 with 3200Mhz RAM...

Opened the last project I was working on. The load was about 50-60% with Intel. I didn't check the actual CPU load before.

On Ryzen it's about 40-50%. Actual CPU load is about 8-10%. Separate core load varies between 5-15%. Nothing else is run on the system, no other background processes, just W10. I'm working with a 512 buffer and only mixing.

What the heck. Per benchmarks 3600 is about 2.5-3x faster than 4690 in multicore/threaded applications. I expected my ASIOguard meter to drop proportionally to like 15-20% at least. Not to stay at the same level. Can someone please explain. Can Asioguard only handle a specific number of plugins regardless of what CPU is used or something?

Is Cubase just not optimized for new Ryzen chips?

Is ASIOguard just a detrimental feature that I need to turn off? Per guys at scanaudio it looks like it is http://www.scanproaudio.info/2019/07/22 ... omparison/
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by MrSoundman » Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:37 pm

I'm guessing it's because your maximum clock on the Ryzen 3600 is only 10% faster than the i5-4690.
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by skijumptoes » Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:38 pm

Single thread performance plays a big key as well as your DAW settings - you can't look at multithread as the only factor and think that you will get 300% more power - it just doesn't work like that, as well as the single core bottleneck you have real-time CPU performance playing a big factor in DAWs - it's not just linear number crunching like a lot of benchmarks.

Comparing in the manner you're doing is very mis-leading, If you don't get dropouts is the most important factor, right? You'd have to push both to the limit to really compare the CPU's, and then decide whether ASIO guard suits your application or not. Until you get issues, just enjoy using it and not get dragged away from the music.

Note that the figure shown is an ASIO engine meter in Cubase, it's not a normal CPU meter - that's what you find in your OS's task monitor, and is quite different.

It's a longish watch, but may be of interest:- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUsLLEkswzE

What you will find is that the more you add to a project, the better the Ryzen will prove to be, it's always the way when you move to a greater multithreaded CPU.

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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by Nuieve » Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:39 am

MrSoundman wrote:
Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:37 pm
I'm guessing it's because your maximum clock on the Ryzen 3600 is only 10% faster than the i5-4690.
CPU power is not determined by only a clock speed.
skijumptoes wrote:
Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:38 pm
It's a longish watch, but may be of interest:- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUsLLEkswzE

What you will find is that the more you add to a project, the better the Ryzen will prove to be, it's always the way when you move to a greater multithreaded CPU.
I hope it handles higher plugin loads better, it better do otherwise I don't know what I just spent tons of money on... :mrgreen:

It still makes zero sense. With basic system loads being equal between old and new system, the new arrived power goes where exactly? What is preventing from it being utilized?

When I'm done reinstalling everything else I'll throw a few dozen Waves Mixhubs in the mix, see how Ryzen handles that. I used to max out with about 25 of them with my old i5.

Btw that video is pretty much useless. It just blames monitor or HDD for holding off CPU processing which makes zero sense. Isn't your project loaded into RAM in its entirety? And all the processing happens between RAM and CPU? What does monitor or HDD have to do with it being able to do it? He's rambling on about some magical processes putting a stick into a rolling CPU wheel, I'm not aware of anything that can do that.

I think that Pete guys who did Cubase testing is on to something, I think asioguard/cubase is not optimized for AMD CPUs and not behaving themselves. I understand that Steinberg team had no chance to work with these CPUs beforehand as even mobo manufacturers weren't given a chance to prepare working BIOSes by AMD, so I hope things will get better/clearer in the near future.

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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by GlennO » Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:31 am

As skijumptoes explained, you might have unreasonable expectations here. You don't say anything about your benchmark, but 100% utilization of your cpu capacity would require absolutely perfect conditions...conditions which will never occur in the real world. Load balancing is profoundly affected by how plugins are allocated to your tracks and how your signals are routed, and thread synchronization is a a significant overhead in any DAW. Taking full advantage of clock speed in a DAW is a simple matter. Taking full advantage of multiple cores in a DAW is not a simple matter at all.

Yes, the person in that video is hilariously uninformed :).
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by Nuieve » Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:02 am

I just did what I upgraded my PC for, to use more newer plugins. Well, bitter disappointment. Waves Mixhub doesn't work with Ryzen 3xxx... I only got 3 instances before maxxing out the CPU.

Not 100% sure if it's solely between Waves and Ryzen or if Cubase has something to do with it.

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I suspect that's the reason I might be having some issues with CPU load, could be a thing or two there that eats up 30% of my CPU. Oh damn.

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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by folkfreak » Sat Jul 27, 2019 6:40 am

AFIK Ryzens don't handle low latency stuff very well, so they might not be suited for daw work.

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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by mr.roos » Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:18 am

Nuieve, could you post a pic of your DAW running LatencyMon for 30 minutes? After I built my new PC I discovered there's quite a bit of tweeking needed to sort Win10 1903. Also is your new memory actually running at 3200? Is your Ryzen chip 12 cores?
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by Nuieve » Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:11 am

mr.roos wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:18 am
Nuieve, could you post a pic of your DAW running LatencyMon for 30 minutes? After I built my new PC I discovered there's quite a bit of tweeking needed to sort Win10 1903. Also is your new memory actually running at 3200? Is your Ryzen chip 12 cores?
6 core 12 thread, all showing active. Memory is set to 3200Mhz.

Here's 1hr LatencyMon report:

Code: Select all

___________________________________________________________________________________________
CONCLUSION
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Your system appears to be having trouble handling real-time audio and other tasks. You are likely to experience buffer underruns appearing as drop outs, clicks or pops. One or more DPC routines that belong to a driver running in your system appear to be executing for too long. One problem may be related to power management, disable CPU throttling settings in Control Panel and BIOS setup. Check for BIOS updates. 
LatencyMon has been analyzing your system for  1:02:05  (h:mm:ss) on all processors.https://www.steinberg.net/forums/posting.php?mode=edit&f=283&p=883738


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
SYSTEM INFORMATION
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Computer name:                                        DESKTOP-NBL11U7
OS version:                                           Windows 10 , 10.0, version 1903, build: 18362 (x64)
Hardware:                                             MS-7B87, Micro-Star International Co., Ltd., B450M GAMING PLUS (MS-7B87)
CPU:                                                  AuthenticAMD AMD Ryzen 5 3600 6-Core Processor 
Logical processors:                                   12
Processor groups:                                     1
RAM:                                                  16335 MB total


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU SPEED
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Reported CPU speed:                                   360 MHz

Note: reported execution times may be calculated based on a fixed reported CPU speed. Disable variable speed settings like Intel Speed Step and AMD Cool N Quiet in the BIOS setup for more accurate results.

WARNING: the CPU speed that was measured is only a fraction of the CPU speed reported. Your CPUs may be throttled back due to variable speed settings and thermal issues. It is suggested that you run a utility which reports your actual CPU frequency and temperature. 



_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
MEASURED INTERRUPT TO USER PROCESS LATENCIES
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
The interrupt to process latency reflects the measured interval that a usermode process needed to respond to a hardware request from the moment the interrupt service routine started execution. This includes the scheduling and execution of a DPC routine, the signaling of an event and the waking up of a usermode thread from an idle wait state in response to that event.

Highest measured interrupt to process latency (µs):   650.70
Average measured interrupt to process latency (µs):   5.654021

Highest measured interrupt to DPC latency (µs):       195.30
Average measured interrupt to DPC latency (µs):       1.855227


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
 REPORTED ISRs
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Interrupt service routines are routines installed by the OS and device drivers that execute in response to a hardware interrupt signal.

Highest ISR routine execution time (µs):              395.170
Driver with highest ISR routine execution time:       Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft Corporation

Highest reported total ISR routine time (%):          0.000472
Driver with highest ISR total time:                   Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft Corporation

Total time spent in ISRs (%)                          0.000478

ISR count (execution time <250 µs):                   254552
ISR count (execution time 250-500 µs):                0
ISR count (execution time 500-999 µs):                4
ISR count (execution time 1000-1999 µs):              0
ISR count (execution time 2000-3999 µs):              0
ISR count (execution time >=4000 µs):                 0


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED DPCs
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
DPC routines are part of the interrupt servicing dispatch mechanism and disable the possibility for a process to utilize the CPU while it is interrupted until the DPC has finished execution.

Highest DPC routine execution time (µs):              180691.324722
Driver with highest DPC routine execution time:       ntoskrnl.exe - NT Kernel & System, Microsoft Corporation

Highest reported total DPC routine time (%):          0.007899
Driver with highest DPC total execution time:         Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft Corporation

Total time spent in DPCs (%)                          0.011449

DPC count (execution time <250 µs):                   386378
DPC count (execution time 250-500 µs):                0
DPC count (execution time 500-999 µs):                445
DPC count (execution time 1000-1999 µs):              1
DPC count (execution time 2000-3999 µs):              0
DPC count (execution time >=4000 µs):                 0


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
 REPORTED HARD PAGEFAULTS
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Hard pagefaults are events that get triggered by making use of virtual memory that is not resident in RAM but backed by a memory mapped file on disk. The process of resolving the hard pagefault requires reading in the memory from disk while the process is interrupted and blocked from execution.

NOTE: some processes were hit by hard pagefaults. If these were programs producing audio, they are likely to interrupt the audio stream resulting in dropouts, clicks and pops. Check the Processes tab to see which programs were hit.

Process with highest pagefault count:                 microsoft.photos.exe

Total number of hard pagefaults                       3756
Hard pagefault count of hardest hit process:          1810
Number of processes hit:                              34


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
 PER CPU DATA
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 0 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       22.371412
CPU 0 ISR highest execution time (µs):                348.840
CPU 0 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.159453
CPU 0 ISR count:                                      162877
CPU 0 DPC highest execution time (µs):                607.150
CPU 0 DPC total execution time (s):                   3.860448
CPU 0 DPC count:                                      304577
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 1 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       6.280776
CPU 1 ISR highest execution time (µs):                0.0
CPU 1 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.0
CPU 1 ISR count:                                      0
CPU 1 DPC highest execution time (µs):                209.270
CPU 1 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.000481
CPU 1 DPC count:                                      166
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 2 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       2.186659
CPU 2 ISR highest execution time (µs):                0.0
CPU 2 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.0
CPU 2 ISR count:                                      0
CPU 2 DPC highest execution time (µs):                180691.324722
CPU 2 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.183679
CPU 2 DPC count:                                      956
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 3 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       2.141388
CPU 3 ISR highest execution time (µs):                0.0
CPU 3 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.0
CPU 3 ISR count:                                      0
CPU 3 DPC highest execution time (µs):                183.480
CPU 3 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.000702
CPU 3 DPC count:                                      240
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 4 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       1.372586
CPU 4 ISR highest execution time (µs):                0.0
CPU 4 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.0
CPU 4 ISR count:                                      0
CPU 4 DPC highest execution time (µs):                124.040
CPU 4 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.001156
CPU 4 DPC count:                                      413
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 5 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       1.350336
CPU 5 ISR highest execution time (µs):                0.0
CPU 5 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.0
CPU 5 ISR count:                                      0
CPU 5 DPC highest execution time (µs):                9.610
CPU 5 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.000091
CPU 5 DPC count:                                      38
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 6 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       5.669181
CPU 6 ISR highest execution time (µs):                0.0
CPU 6 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.0
CPU 6 ISR count:                                      0
CPU 6 DPC highest execution time (µs):                180666.069167
CPU 6 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.608267
CPU 6 DPC count:                                      55586
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 7 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       12.051184
CPU 7 ISR highest execution time (µs):                0.0
CPU 7 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.0
CPU 7 ISR count:                                      0
CPU 7 DPC highest execution time (µs):                179.070
CPU 7 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.002504
CPU 7 DPC count:                                      1422
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 8 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       9.432519
CPU 8 ISR highest execution time (µs):                395.170
CPU 8 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.033521
CPU 8 ISR count:                                      69665
CPU 8 DPC highest execution time (µs):                502.110
CPU 8 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.254631
CPU 8 DPC count:                                      13727
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 9 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       6.101011
CPU 9 ISR highest execution time (µs):                1.710
CPU 9 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.000169
CPU 9 ISR count:                                      449
CPU 9 DPC highest execution time (µs):                313.920
CPU 9 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.001121
CPU 9 DPC count:                                      197
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 10 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       11.764788
CPU 10 ISR highest execution time (µs):                16.130
CPU 10 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.002150
CPU 10 ISR count:                                      4880
CPU 10 DPC highest execution time (µs):                198.610
CPU 10 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.003812
CPU 10 DPC count:                                      511
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 11 Interrupt cycle time (s):                       16.219723
CPU 11 ISR highest execution time (µs):                7.0
CPU 11 ISR total execution time (s):                   0.018540
CPU 11 ISR count:                                      16685
CPU 11 DPC highest execution time (µs):                1168.360
CPU 11 DPC total execution time (s):                   0.200919
CPU 11 DPC count:                                      8993
_______________________________
__________________________________________________________________________

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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by MrSoundman » Sat Jul 27, 2019 2:49 pm

Nuieve wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:39 am
MrSoundman wrote:
Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:37 pm
I'm guessing it's because your maximum clock on the Ryzen 3600 is only 10% faster than the i5-4690.
CPU power is not determined by only a clock speed.
No, depending on how you define "power", but single-threaded processing speed through a VST plugin is.
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by GlennO » Sat Jul 27, 2019 2:57 pm

Nuieve wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:02 am
I just did what I upgraded my PC for, to use more newer plugins. Well, bitter disappointment.
With a single track case like that, you shouldn't expect to see much difference between your old cpu and your new cpu.
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by Nuieve » Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:14 pm

GlennO wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 2:57 pm
Nuieve wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:02 am
I just did what I upgraded my PC for, to use more newer plugins. Well, bitter disappointment.
With a single track case like that, you shouldn't expect to see much difference between your old cpu and your new cpu.
What single track case?

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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by strummer » Sat Jul 27, 2019 9:16 pm

Nuieve wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:11 am
Your system appears to be having trouble handling real-time audio and other tasks. You are likely to experience buffer underruns appearing as drop outs, clicks or pops. One or more DPC routines that belong to a driver running in your system appear to be executing for too long. One problem may be related to power management, disable CPU throttling settings in Control Panel and BIOS setup. Check for BIOS updates.
LatencyMon has been analyzing your system for 1:02:05 (h:mm:ss) on all processors.


Hi
Just wondering if you have acted on the info above?
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by GlennO » Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:31 pm

Nuieve wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:14 pm
GlennO wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 2:57 pm
Nuieve wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:02 am
I just did what I upgraded my PC for, to use more newer plugins. Well, bitter disappointment.
With a single track case like that, you shouldn't expect to see much difference between your old cpu and your new cpu.
What single track case?
With a single track case like the one in the picture you posted, you shouldn't expect to see much difference between your old cpu and your new cpu.
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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by peakae » Sat Jul 27, 2019 11:23 pm

This is on a fresh Win10 install ?
All drivers and BIOS updated ? (LatencyMon is reporting some driver being the problem)
Power settings in Windows set to max performance ?
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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by MrSoundman » Sun Jul 28, 2019 12:18 am

Try disabling SMT.
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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by mr.roos » Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:25 am

I have a similar PC but Intel equipped, 6 cores, etc.

BUT LOOK: My PC says that my CPU speed is 3192 MHz......and yours says 360 MHz! Something is very wrong here.
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by Nuieve » Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:39 am

GlennO wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:31 pm
With a single track case like the one in the picture you posted, you shouldn't expect to see much difference between your old cpu and your new cpu.
No, I was talking about other songs, 50+ audio tracks, 100+ plugins. That drum loop was just to show Mixhub bug.
peakae wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 11:23 pm
This is on a fresh Win10 install ?
All drivers and BIOS updated ? (LatencyMon is reporting some driver being the problem)
Power settings in Windows set to max performance ?
Yes, fresh new W10. All drivers are the newest. Power set to max.

I just did some additional troubleshooting. So much crap in W10, phone, bluetooth, microphone... what? lol. Had to go menu by menu to disable every single millenial feature, uninstall all the millenial "apps". So much junk.

I uninstalled Radeon Catalyst software, seems like it was causing a lot of hards, also disconnected USB backup drive (there was some diskport of something causing hards too). I uninstalled Intel SSD monitoring health tool whatever it's called.

Basically got rid of everything. Result is below...
MrSoundman wrote:
Sun Jul 28, 2019 12:18 am
Try disabling SMT.
I did. Overlaid the result over the latencymon picture. Picture is too small, the higher load is with HT off. So I'm keeping it on.
mr.roos wrote:
Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:25 am
I have a similar PC but Intel equipped, 6 cores, etc.

BUT LOOK: My PC says that my CPU speed is 3192 MHz......and yours says 360 MHz! Something is very wrong here.
It's a LatencyMon bug. I double checked that with HWmonitor and CPU always runs at 3600-4200. It never runs at 360Mhz, lol.

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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by mr.roos » Sun Jul 28, 2019 1:49 am

This was only for 17 mins but take a look, Nuieve and GlennO:_

________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CONCLUSION
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Your system appears to be suitable for handling real-time audio and other tasks without dropouts.
LatencyMon has been analyzing your system for 0:18:08 (h:mm:ss) on all processors.


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
SYSTEM INFORMATION
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Computer name: DAW
OS version: Windows 10 , 10.0, version 1903, build: 18362 (x64)
Hardware: Z390 DESIGNARE, Gigabyte Technology Co., Ltd., Z390 DESIGNARE-CF
CPU: GenuineIntel Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-8700 CPU @ 3.20GHz
Logical processors: 12
Processor groups: 1
RAM: 32700 MB total


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU SPEED
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Reported CPU speed: 3192 MHz

Note: reported execution times may be calculated based on a fixed reported CPU speed. Disable variable speed settings like Intel Speed Step and AMD Cool N Quiet in the BIOS setup for more accurate results.

WARNING: the CPU speed that was measured is only a fraction of the CPU speed reported. Your CPUs may be throttled back due to variable speed settings and thermal issues. It is suggested that you run a utility which reports your actual CPU frequency and temperature.



_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
MEASURED INTERRUPT TO USER PROCESS LATENCIES
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
The interrupt to process latency reflects the measured interval that a usermode process needed to respond to a hardware request from the moment the interrupt service routine started execution. This includes the scheduling and execution of a DPC routine, the signaling of an event and the waking up of a usermode thread from an idle wait state in response to that event.

Highest measured interrupt to process latency (µs): 127.0
Average measured interrupt to process latency (µs): 2.513528

Highest measured interrupt to DPC latency (µs): 125.30
Average measured interrupt to DPC latency (µs): 0.902105


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED ISRs
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Interrupt service routines are routines installed by the OS and device drivers that execute in response to a hardware interrupt signal.

Highest ISR routine execution time (µs): 2.167293
Driver with highest ISR routine execution time: Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft Corporation

Highest reported total ISR routine time (%): 0.000053
Driver with highest ISR total time: Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft Corporation

Total time spent in ISRs (%) 0.000053

ISR count (execution time <250 µs): 14440
ISR count (execution time 250-500 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 500-999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 1000-1999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 2000-3999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time >=4000 µs): 0


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED DPCs
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
DPC routines are part of the interrupt servicing dispatch mechanism and disable the possibility for a process to utilize the CPU while it is interrupted until the DPC has finished execution.

Highest DPC routine execution time (µs): 214.504386
Driver with highest DPC routine execution time: ntoskrnl.exe - NT Kernel & System, Microsoft Corporation

Highest reported total DPC routine time (%): 0.003146
Driver with highest DPC total execution time: dxgkrnl.sys - DirectX Graphics Kernel, Microsoft Corporation

Total time spent in DPCs (%) 0.009657

DPC count (execution time <250 µs): 688580
DPC count (execution time 250-500 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time 500-999 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time 1000-1999 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time 2000-3999 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time >=4000 µs): 0


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED HARD PAGEFAULTS
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Hard pagefaults are events that get triggered by making use of virtual memory that is not resident in RAM but backed by a memory mapped file on disk. The process of resolving the hard pagefault requires reading in the memory from disk while the process is interrupted and blocked from execution.

NOTE: some processes were hit by hard pagefaults. If these were programs producing audio, they are likely to interrupt the audio stream resulting in dropouts, clicks and pops. Check the Processes tab to see which programs were hit.

Process with highest pagefault count: ctfmon.exe

Total number of hard pagefaults 149
Hard pagefault count of hardest hit process: 59
Number of processes hit: 10


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
PER CPU DATA
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 0 Interrupt cycle time (s): 2.822690
CPU 0 ISR highest execution time (µs): 2.167293
CPU 0 ISR total execution time (s): 0.006972
CPU 0 ISR count: 14440
CPU 0 DPC highest execution time (µs): 127.661028
CPU 0 DPC total execution time (s): 1.087984
CPU 0 DPC count: 596664
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 1 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.367545
CPU 1 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 1 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 1 ISR count: 0
CPU 1 DPC highest execution time (µs): 7.913847
CPU 1 DPC total execution time (s): 0.000069
CPU 1 DPC count: 39
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 2 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.479415
CPU 2 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 2 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 2 ISR count: 0
CPU 2 DPC highest execution time (µs): 16.990602
CPU 2 DPC total execution time (s): 0.023074
CPU 2 DPC count: 17347
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 3 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.405062
CPU 3 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 3 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 3 ISR count: 0
CPU 3 DPC highest execution time (µs): 43.417920
CPU 3 DPC total execution time (s): 0.002689
CPU 3 DPC count: 1799
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 4 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.548061
CPU 4 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 4 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 4 ISR count: 0
CPU 4 DPC highest execution time (µs): 52.989348
CPU 4 DPC total execution time (s): 0.032058
CPU 4 DPC count: 21657
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 5 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.354178
CPU 5 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 5 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 5 ISR count: 0
CPU 5 DPC highest execution time (µs): 8.024123
CPU 5 DPC total execution time (s): 0.000203
CPU 5 DPC count: 147
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 6 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.478457
CPU 6 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 6 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 6 ISR count: 0
CPU 6 DPC highest execution time (µs): 54.656642
CPU 6 DPC total execution time (s): 0.009910
CPU 6 DPC count: 5751
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 7 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.427844
CPU 7 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 7 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 7 ISR count: 0
CPU 7 DPC highest execution time (µs): 23.137531
CPU 7 DPC total execution time (s): 0.003226
CPU 7 DPC count: 1561
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 8 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.533238
CPU 8 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 8 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 8 ISR count: 0
CPU 8 DPC highest execution time (µs): 214.504386
CPU 8 DPC total execution time (s): 0.037441
CPU 8 DPC count: 16840
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 9 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.435895
CPU 9 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 9 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 9 ISR count: 0
CPU 9 DPC highest execution time (µs): 23.051692
CPU 9 DPC total execution time (s): 0.001984
CPU 9 DPC count: 748
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 10 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.802054
CPU 10 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 10 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 10 ISR count: 0
CPU 10 DPC highest execution time (µs): 20.198935
CPU 10 DPC total execution time (s): 0.060835
CPU 10 DPC count: 25509
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 11 Interrupt cycle time (s): 0.402713
CPU 11 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 11 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 11 ISR count: 0
CPU 11 DPC highest execution time (µs): 18.196429
CPU 11 DPC total execution time (s): 0.001782
CPU 11 DPC count: 518
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Cubase 10 Pro from SX3, WaveLab Pro 9.5, iC Pro remote app, Win10 64-bit (1903 update installed), Intel i7 8700 Coffee Lake 6-Core 3.2GHz, 32G DDR4 3200, Gigabyte Z390 Designare MB, Radeon RX570 Graphics card, Mackie 1640i (FireWire via TI chipset PCI-E card), M-Audio Keystation 61es controller via an M-Audio Midi-Sport 1X1.

skijumptoes
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Re: Upgraded to a 3x faster CPU, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by skijumptoes » Sun Jul 28, 2019 2:51 am

Nuieve wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:39 am
It still makes zero sense. With basic system loads being equal between old and new system, the new arrived power goes where exactly? What is preventing from it being utilized?
It does make more than zero sense, for starters if your old CPU was running at 40% load and this new CPU is at 30% that’s not 10% difference it’s 25% difference I.e. (100/40)*30 = 75(%) load comparison. The bottleneck of any processor is the single core speed and CPU benchmarks published online show approx 29% difference between the two, which roughly equates to this difference that you’re seeing.

Remember that plugins on a single track can only run within the same CPU thread, as the audio has to go through each plugin in order thus cannot run in parallel, i.e. processing of plugin B cannot start until plugin A has finished,and so on.

Also, important is that you’re reading the ASIO performance meter in Cubase, it’s not a CPU meter. What it’s reading is the amount of ASIO performance currently being used based on the available resources that the ASIO engine has. These engines have inherent limits themselves, it’s not an infinite pool of power due to the real-time CPU demands - so finding the sweet point for your CPU and interface is key (including Asio guard settings).

So, basically, the more you step up the usage the more resources the ASIO engine will start to utilise the additional cores - I.e. the more pieces it has the more efficient it can become. In effect what you’re seeing is the capacity of the most loaded core as that’s the bottleneck, there comes a midpoint where you can continue adding plugins and the Performance meter doesn’t move by the same increments as it did when you only had a few plugins running.

That’s where your additional cores ‘should’ come into play. However, as you’ve mentioned it’s perfectly possible (and not so surprising) that an intel i5 has better optimisation with Cubase at this stage. It’s well established architecture, and the motherboard maturity plays a huge part in this puzzle.

Bottom line, the only way to truly test each CPU is to find out their optimal settings and keep piling on plugins till you start getting artefacts/dropouts.

Unless you get real problems I wouldn’t let it bother you too much. And just enjoy making music. You’re yet to know, or hit the limit in general use, right?

Nuieve
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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by Nuieve » Sun Jul 28, 2019 3:51 am

I understand what you're saying.

29% difference between each core.
Of 4.
So there should've been at least 25-30% difference just there.

But I have two more cores.
And 6 more threads.
And faster memory.

6 core should be 1.5 faster than 4 core. 6 cores that are 30% faster should be how much faster than 4 cores? And working with almost twice faster memory?

There should've been much more difference. But obivously only Steinberg knows where it all went.

Anyway, like I said and like you said, Cubase is probably favoring Intel right now. But now that with massive popularity of Ryzen 3 I hope Steinberg will optimize the Cubase for it in the future updates.

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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by Nuieve » Sun Jul 28, 2019 5:47 am

Ok, couldn't find peace with this, did some more testing. Well result is very surprising.

I add a track with 16 instances of Kramer tape to a channel. Asio meter goes up to ~72%.
I add another track with 16 instances (2nd track), nothing happens, still at ~75%.
I add two more tracks with 16 instances each (4 tracks total now), meter goes up to something like 85%.
I add two more tracks, one at a time, meter goes up by a few % each time but after 6th one it starts stuttering a bit but doesn't go red.
(see attached gif)
Each channel takes up about 6-7% of actual CPU use. At the moment of stuttering CPU is used at 43%.
asio.gif
(191.2 KiB) Not downloaded yet
So the actual ASIO meter graph is not linear at all, and this whole thread is one big confusion.

But the performance is actually very impressive. Kramer's tape is one of Waves most CPU hungry plugins. 96 instances of that, I'll take it. I think 3600 is fine.

Much happier now. :D
Last edited by Nuieve on Sun Jul 28, 2019 6:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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peakae
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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by peakae » Sun Jul 28, 2019 6:07 am

More likely that future compilers and programming tools slowly will catch up. Then we will see better performance from programs using these updated compilers.
The next major win10 update should include an optimized thread scheduler, but that is more geared towards threadripper, if I am not mistaken.
The ASIO meter is not that precise, have had projects showing 70% that I easily could double the amount of tracks and plugins and then would show 85%. Really depends on track type, plugins and routing.
Don’t be to obsessed with that meter, if you have Latencymonitor giving you a clean bill of health.
Did you try running all cores at a fixed clock ?
Cubase Pro 10, Wavelab Elements 9, I7 3770K , win10x64, 16Gb Ram, RME Raydat, Steinberg MR816x, Motu 828mkII, Behringer ADA8200, Yamaha moXF6, Steinberg UR242, Yamaha THR 10, Grace Design m900, CMC TP, CMC CH.

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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by peakae » Sun Jul 28, 2019 6:08 am

Oh I wrote while you were posting :-)
Cubase Pro 10, Wavelab Elements 9, I7 3770K , win10x64, 16Gb Ram, RME Raydat, Steinberg MR816x, Motu 828mkII, Behringer ADA8200, Yamaha moXF6, Steinberg UR242, Yamaha THR 10, Grace Design m900, CMC TP, CMC CH.

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Re: Upgraded to 3x faster CPU, a Ryzen 3600, seeing only 10% decrease in ASIO performance meter...

Post by mr.roos » Sun Jul 28, 2019 7:40 am

I agree that Win10 1903 is an OS that needs a lot of work to make it better for DAW use. I also think it appreciates a lot of memory, too.

Nuieve here's a 3hr + run of LantencyMon that maybe shows a more accurate picture of my PC. Like you, there are many things that I have turned off in Win10.
July 27 2019.PNG
(36.03 KiB) Not downloaded yet
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CONCLUSION
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Your system appears to be suitable for handling real-time audio and other tasks without dropouts.
LatencyMon has been analyzing your system for 3:30:36 (h:mm:ss) on all processors.


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
SYSTEM INFORMATION
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Computer name: DAW
OS version: Windows 10 , 10.0, version 1903, build: 18362 (x64)
Hardware: Z390 DESIGNARE, Gigabyte Technology Co., Ltd., Z390 DESIGNARE-CF
CPU: GenuineIntel Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-8700 CPU @ 3.20GHz
Logical processors: 12
Processor groups: 1
RAM: 32700 MB total


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU SPEED
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Reported CPU speed: 3192 MHz

Note: reported execution times may be calculated based on a fixed reported CPU speed. Disable variable speed settings like Intel Speed Step and AMD Cool N Quiet in the BIOS setup for more accurate results.

WARNING: the CPU speed that was measured is only a fraction of the CPU speed reported. Your CPUs may be throttled back due to variable speed settings and thermal issues. It is suggested that you run a utility which reports your actual CPU frequency and temperature.



_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
MEASURED INTERRUPT TO USER PROCESS LATENCIES
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
The interrupt to process latency reflects the measured interval that a usermode process needed to respond to a hardware request from the moment the interrupt service routine started execution. This includes the scheduling and execution of a DPC routine, the signaling of an event and the waking up of a usermode thread from an idle wait state in response to that event.

Highest measured interrupt to process latency (µs): 49.30
Average measured interrupt to process latency (µs): 2.555243

Highest measured interrupt to DPC latency (µs): 47.30
Average measured interrupt to DPC latency (µs): 0.879128


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED ISRs
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Interrupt service routines are routines installed by the OS and device drivers that execute in response to a hardware interrupt signal.

Highest ISR routine execution time (µs): 27.353697
Driver with highest ISR routine execution time: Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft Corporation

Highest reported total ISR routine time (%): 0.020575
Driver with highest ISR total time: Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft Corporation

Total time spent in ISRs (%) 0.020575

ISR count (execution time <250 µs): 9398813
ISR count (execution time 250-500 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 500-999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 1000-1999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time 2000-3999 µs): 0
ISR count (execution time >=4000 µs): 0


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED DPCs
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
DPC routines are part of the interrupt servicing dispatch mechanism and disable the possibility for a process to utilize the CPU while it is interrupted until the DPC has finished execution.

Highest DPC routine execution time (µs): 217.753133
Driver with highest DPC routine execution time: ntoskrnl.exe - NT Kernel & System, Microsoft Corporation

Highest reported total DPC routine time (%): 0.064355
Driver with highest DPC total execution time: Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft Corporation

Total time spent in DPCs (%) 0.070397

DPC count (execution time <250 µs): 16088072
DPC count (execution time 250-500 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time 500-999 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time 1000-1999 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time 2000-3999 µs): 0
DPC count (execution time >=4000 µs): 0


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
REPORTED HARD PAGEFAULTS
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Hard pagefaults are events that get triggered by making use of virtual memory that is not resident in RAM but backed by a memory mapped file on disk. The process of resolving the hard pagefault requires reading in the memory from disk while the process is interrupted and blocked from execution.

NOTE: some processes were hit by hard pagefaults. If these were programs producing audio, they are likely to interrupt the audio stream resulting in dropouts, clicks and pops. Check the Processes tab to see which programs were hit.

Process with highest pagefault count: settingsynchost.exe

Total number of hard pagefaults 4016
Hard pagefault count of hardest hit process: 781
Number of processes hit: 15


_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
PER CPU DATA
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 0 Interrupt cycle time (s): 156.090373
CPU 0 ISR highest execution time (µs): 27.353697
CPU 0 ISR total execution time (s): 31.199884
CPU 0 ISR count: 9398813
CPU 0 DPC highest execution time (µs): 56.001880
CPU 0 DPC total execution time (s): 104.716646
CPU 0 DPC count: 15082084
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 1 Interrupt cycle time (s): 4.502605
CPU 1 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 1 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 1 ISR count: 0
CPU 1 DPC highest execution time (µs): 28.808584
CPU 1 DPC total execution time (s): 0.013449
CPU 1 DPC count: 6354
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 2 Interrupt cycle time (s): 5.596540
CPU 2 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 2 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 2 ISR count: 0
CPU 2 DPC highest execution time (µs): 217.487782
CPU 2 DPC total execution time (s): 0.181364
CPU 2 DPC count: 114356
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 3 Interrupt cycle time (s): 4.315084
CPU 3 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 3 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 3 ISR count: 0
CPU 3 DPC highest execution time (µs): 215.547932
CPU 3 DPC total execution time (s): 0.005218
CPU 3 DPC count: 3150
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 4 Interrupt cycle time (s): 6.147476
CPU 4 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 4 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 4 ISR count: 0
CPU 4 DPC highest execution time (µs): 17.424185
CPU 4 DPC total execution time (s): 0.347323
CPU 4 DPC count: 220132
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 5 Interrupt cycle time (s): 4.376886
CPU 5 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 5 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 5 ISR count: 0
CPU 5 DPC highest execution time (µs): 213.399123
CPU 5 DPC total execution time (s): 0.00420
CPU 5 DPC count: 2211
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 6 Interrupt cycle time (s): 6.272532
CPU 6 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 6 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 6 ISR count: 0
CPU 6 DPC highest execution time (µs): 217.736216
CPU 6 DPC total execution time (s): 0.160242
CPU 6 DPC count: 75177
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 7 Interrupt cycle time (s): 4.387472
CPU 7 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 7 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 7 ISR count: 0
CPU 7 DPC highest execution time (µs): 215.845238
CPU 7 DPC total execution time (s): 0.004212
CPU 7 DPC count: 1946
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 8 Interrupt cycle time (s): 5.881305
CPU 8 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 8 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 8 ISR count: 0
CPU 8 DPC highest execution time (µs): 217.753133
CPU 8 DPC total execution time (s): 0.185063
CPU 8 DPC count: 84443
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 9 Interrupt cycle time (s): 4.531944
CPU 9 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 9 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 9 ISR count: 0
CPU 9 DPC highest execution time (µs): 215.204574
CPU 9 DPC total execution time (s): 0.021678
CPU 9 DPC count: 8725
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 10 Interrupt cycle time (s): 8.431410
CPU 10 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 10 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 10 ISR count: 0
CPU 10 DPC highest execution time (µs): 214.877506
CPU 10 DPC total execution time (s): 1.094094
CPU 10 DPC count: 483647
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
CPU 11 Interrupt cycle time (s): 4.472717
CPU 11 ISR highest execution time (µs): 0.0
CPU 11 ISR total execution time (s): 0.0
CPU 11 ISR count: 0
CPU 11 DPC highest execution time (µs): 216.657581
CPU 11 DPC total execution time (s): 0.017503
CPU 11 DPC count: 5847
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Cubase 10 Pro from SX3, WaveLab Pro 9.5, iC Pro remote app, Win10 64-bit (1903 update installed), Intel i7 8700 Coffee Lake 6-Core 3.2GHz, 32G DDR4 3200, Gigabyte Z390 Designare MB, Radeon RX570 Graphics card, Mackie 1640i (FireWire via TI chipset PCI-E card), M-Audio Keystation 61es controller via an M-Audio Midi-Sport 1X1.

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