CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

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CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:48 am

Hi,

On all the computers I've checked, CC7 & CC10 are not on the quick controls drop-down list:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/15WGwgq ... sp=sharing

Why is that?

Thanks!
HD

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by luga01 » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:23 am

CC7 and CC10 are volume and pan which appear at the top of the quick control selection list.
Russ

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Mon Jun 11, 2018 8:25 am

Not when it comes to an Instrument track.

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:16 pm

luga1 posted the correct info, but you're looking in the wrong place or, by using cc in the search, field you are filtering out what you are looking for.
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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Mon Jun 11, 2018 8:09 pm

As you can see in the picture, I'm not using "CC" in the search filed.

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:03 pm

I beg to differ! :)

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:35 pm

Ooops I've looked at luga01 picture instead of mine :)

Either way, his picture show a MIDI track, not an instrument track.
The volume and pan of an instrument track belongs to the audio section, not the MIDI section, therefore, moving them doesn't sends any CC,
which brings me back to square one - where is CC7 and CC10 on an instrument track?
https://drive.google.com/file/d/15WGwgq ... sp=sharing

BTW, how do I embed pics here?

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by GargoyleStudio » Mon Jun 11, 2018 11:08 pm

@dfhagai I think you are right, I noticed this a while back, there is no CC7 or CC10 available for instrument channels. To my mind it should be in the list. I wouldn't say it's a bug but its certainly a deficiency!

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Tue Jun 12, 2018 1:55 am

Do you see them in MIDI tracks??
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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:46 am

-steve- wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 1:55 am
Do you see them in MIDI tracks??
Yes.

I'm a certified Steinberg teacher. I have been teaching Cubase for 12 years and I haven't found the lost CC's yet :)

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Tue Jun 12, 2018 6:26 am

Here, on 9.5.30 quick controls look the same for midi tracks and for instrument tracks. Neither have cc7 and cc10 grouped with the other 125 CCs.
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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:09 pm

They do look the same, but they function differently.

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:44 pm

How then? I'm not sure I understand...
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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by Stephen57 » Tue Jun 12, 2018 6:38 pm

Performed the follow:
0. Create Empty Project
1. Create Instrument Track and simple part.
2. Go to Quick Controls and Search for "cc" (List shown in screenshot)
3. Enable Read on track and record Modulation to Automation Track using Quick Control slot 1

The only difference I observe is that when Modulation is recorded this way, it appears on an Automation Lane and when recorded in the Instrument Track (or MIDI Track), Modulation appears, as usual, within the track. The sound is identical.

It's true that CC 7 and CC 10 are not on my list of CC's but would that not be redundant? Those controllers they are available but labeled Volume and Pan.
CCs on Instrument Track.png
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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Tue Jun 12, 2018 6:56 pm

I know about the CC's in the automation lane of course...that's not what I'm talking about.... :)

Let me ask differently:
Lets say I have Kontakt loaded on an instrument track, and I want to move the volume/pan of the instrument that's loaded into Kontakt, using quick controls (that eventually be recorded in the automation lane of the project window)

You Can't do that!

The only workaround I know is putting "MIDI Control" in the MIDI inserts and connecting it to the Quick Controls, but that is cumbersome and ridiculous...

Here's a pic:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1l1On7w ... sp=sharing

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:05 pm

Certainly nothing so convoluted is required.

QCs are designed so that you would use the plugin's automation. So for Kontakt:

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:34 pm

That's a clumsy solution because:
1. It's Kontakt Specific.
2. It's something you'll have to do every time (unless you save a track preset).

So I ask again - why are CC7 & CC10 discriminated?

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Tue Jun 12, 2018 8:33 pm

Because it's Quick Controls, and not just midi.
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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Tue Jun 12, 2018 8:57 pm

But Quick Controls does sends all the rest of the MIDI controls right?
And that's exactly what doesn't make any sense...

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by GargoyleStudio » Tue Jun 12, 2018 11:12 pm

I think the problem is that with a MIDI track the Volume and Pan CCs are spun out to the top level menu rather than appearing in the CC list. Then, with an Instrument track the Volume and Pan that is in the top level menu is actually the audio channel Volume and Pan rather than MIDI Volume and Pan. But SB haven't put the CC numbers back in the list, so there is no way to control MIDI Volume and Pan from either automation or quick controls.

But, there is a way to get this into an automation lane... Draw some midi volume automation in the Controller Lane in the MIDI editor, 'Extract MIDI Automation' and then you have an automation lane for MIDIChannel-Volume. But it still doesn't appear in the dropdown list and you can't get it to be a Quick Control :)

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:19 am

dfhagai wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 8:57 pm
But Quick Controls does sends all the rest of the MIDI controls right?
And that's exactly what doesn't make any sense...
The design scope and purpose of Quick Controls is for automating VSTs, not to provide an alternate method to send midi commands to the output. But of course, the way we learn the daw isn't by learning the history of how and why a feature has been added. We then extrapolate from the functions we use and draw a conclusion as to what the scope of the feature is. But that might not match the programmers' idea.

So then, one makes a feature request. And if it's fulfilled, another generation of users comprehends this new feature via the same method as above, and the cycle continues. :? :o ;)
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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by -steve- » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:20 am

GargoyleStudio wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 11:12 pm
I think the problem is that with a MIDI track the Volume and Pan CCs are spun out to the top level menu rather than appearing in the CC list. Then, with an Instrument track the Volume and Pan that is in the top level menu is actually the audio channel Volume and Pan rather than MIDI Volume and Pan. But SB haven't put the CC numbers back in the list, so there is no way to control MIDI Volume and Pan from either automation or quick controls.

But, there is a way to get this into an automation lane... Draw some midi volume automation in the Controller Lane in the MIDI editor, 'Extract MIDI Automation' and then you have an automation lane for MIDIChannel-Volume. But it still doesn't appear in the dropdown list and you can't get it to be a Quick Control :)

Mike.
yup!
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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:56 am

So let's make it formal then:
Dear Steinberg - please consider adding CC7 & CC10 to the instrument track quick controls, so we can record it live to an automation lane in the project window. Your nearly there (only two CC's short...) :)

Thanks for your replies guys, really appreciated!

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by dfhagai » Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:05 am

The icing on the cake:
If your MIDI/Instrument track is on channel 1-16, Quick control drop down menu will contain "All CC".
If your MIDI/Instrument track is on channel "Any", Quick control drop down menu will not contain "All CC".
Man....

I do a lot of virtual orchestration and Kontakt scripting, these inconsistencies are soooooooooo.......not good!

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Re: CC7 & CC10 missing in quick controls...

Post by luga01 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:20 am

There are so many shortfalls and inconsistencies in Cubase that in almost 30 years of using it, I've come to the conclusion that much of the functionality I need is by way of a custom macro. I can't comment on whether this is possible in your case but maybe worth experimenting(?).
Most of my work is with real orchestra so I don't do much virtual orchestration and hence I haven't come across this CC7 and CC10 problem.
Hope you get a response from Steinberg.
Russ Shaw

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