Please add ARA integration

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by austinhaynesmusic » Sat Feb 10, 2018 7:46 am

+1! We need ARA support, Steinberg. Really, you guys are always thinking of new things to add and innovating all the time but for some reason are blindsided to adding ARA support. You have a built in pitch tool (Variaudio) which is nice to have just like you have a built in EQ plugin but you don't restrict other plugins in Cubase for EQ so why do you do this by not supporting ARA for Melodyne users? This is getting a little out of hand here. Please incorporate it like other DAWs are doing and not be behind the curve.

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shanabit
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by shanabit » Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:16 am

Yes, add Console 1 support for that minority and skip ARA which could assist all users on AT, Melodyne and Vocalign. I must have missed something here :roll:
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by Romantique Tp » Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:33 am

shanabit wrote:
Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:16 am
Yes, add Console 1 support for that minority and skip ARA which could assist all users on AT, Melodyne and Vocalign. I must have missed something here :roll:
You missed the fact that ARA has been around for over 5 years, yet only 3 big name DAWs had implemented ARA support before December of last year. That should make it pretty obvious that it's not easy to implement.

How is improving support for a DAW controller that already half worked with Cubase even comparable?
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by shanabit » Wed Feb 14, 2018 4:14 pm

You missed the fact that ARA fees were dropped so there is that. I believe the code is available now for free from Celemony? Users have been asking for ARA for YEARS, Console 1 just came to the party IMO
Ask yourself what percentage of Cubase users actually even HAVE a Console 1??

You are missing the fact that out of the 4 DAWS I have only one of them does not support ARA and that is Cubase. Realtime transfers , yeah thats fun. VariAudio needs lots of improvements and one of those is jsut the stupid name HA
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by Romantique Tp » Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:55 pm

Nobody even mentioned licensing or any fees, the SDK has been completely free to use since it was released. It took Reaper 5 years to add ARA support (and AFAIK it's not even out of testing yet, almost 3 months later) despite the fact that they had the SDK since day 1 and the DAW is built in a way that makes it easier to just slap stuff into it.

And again, adding support for a complex SDK can't be compared to extending support for a simple hardware controller. At all. You're free to ask for Steinberg to add stuff but please use your head.
Every time someone says "it must be easy to add/fix", a programmer dies.

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by JMCecil » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:12 pm

Romantique Tp wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:55 pm
Nobody even mentioned licensing or any fees, the SDK has been completely free to use since it was released. It took Reaper 5 years to add ARA support (and AFAIK it's not even out of testing yet, almost 3 months later) despite the fact that they had the SDK since day 1 and the DAW is built in a way that makes it easier to just slap stuff into it.

And again, adding support for a complex SDK can't be compared to extending support for a simple hardware controller. At all. You're free to ask for Steinberg to add stuff but please use your head.
Actually that is very inaccurate and misleading. Using Reaper as the example, the ARA 1.x SDK was not a fit for Reaper's audio processing architecture at all. Reaper is not built to "just slap stuff in" and had ARA continued to use the 1.x SDK methodology, it still would not be in Reaper. The 2.x SDK made it viable for them to support it. And ARA is not in the beta builds yet for Reaper. It is still in development and my guess won't show up for external testing until the v6.x beta builds, whenever that occurs.

The point of all of that is that the ARA 1.x SDK was not something most DAW vendors wanted to mess with. The 2.x ( just announced) seems to be more usable from an integration perspective. That doesn't mean that the DAW vendors just need to "turn it on". It requires developer bandwidth.
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by Romantique Tp » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:34 pm

Yes, I meant to imply that the previous SDK was probably the main reason why so few DAWs supported ARA before ARA 2. I guess I could have worded that better.
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by JMCecil » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:43 pm

I think shanabits valid point is that there are FAAAAR more users that would benefit from ARA integration, especially if the 2.x spec makes it viable, than console 1 integration. Probably something along the lines of 20%+ of the user base vs .01% of the user base.
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by JMCecil » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:46 pm

But what we don't know is how much developer bandwidth Console 1 integration vs ARA integration takes. So both can be worthy feature targets.
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by Quinn3k3 » Sat Feb 17, 2018 2:13 am

I agree with JMCecil. The point of this thread is for users to voice their desire to have ARA implemented and it shouldn't be about complaining that Steinberg added some other feature.

Sure, ARA is very high on my wishlist, hence the thread, but that doesn't mean that I think Steinberg should work on this feature exclusively. There are plenty of worthy feature requests out there but hopefully with enough support, we can make this something that is hard for Steinberg to ignore.

At the end of the day, I think Steinberg wants to give their user base features that makes them want to continue to upgrade and at the same time make their product attractive to new customers that are choosing a new DAW. If they believe that not having ARA is going to hurt their business, they with allocate the resources it takes to implement it regardless of how difficult it may be.

Between this and he other ARA threads out there, I think it is already pretty clear that quite a few users want this feature, but adding posts and views will only strengthen our case.

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by TNM » Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:11 am

i'm in.. would love ARA integrated
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by JClosed » Mon Feb 26, 2018 12:44 pm

Well - I already have said I would like to see ARA integration, and I do not think that VariAudio is threatened by it. However - Seeing the above conversation I want to point out that I DO think VariAudio is one of the reasons it will take time to integrate ARA in Cubase.

The problem is that the developers must make sure ARA and VariAudio will play well with each other. Ditching VariAudio is simply not an option, because a lot of people (including myself) have a lot of projects where VariAudio is used. Also - I do not think a lot of people would be pleased to be forced to buy Melodyne, when Cubase already has some build-in completely free Melodyne-like stuff. As an (almost-ex) user of Sonar Platinum I got Melodyne Essential for free, but if I had not gotten that program for free I do not think I would not have bought Melodyne Essential as a replacement for VariAudio.

Anyway - The problem here is, that there is code in Cubase that handles VariAudio. I do not have any insight in how that support is coded, but I do not think I am far off when I guess there will be some big clashes when two programs (or pieces of programs) try to do the same thing at the same time. For instance - How would ARA handle audio that has already been altered by VariAudio (or VariAudio has to handle audio that has been altered by ARA). Do those two program pieces have to cooperate, or must audio handled by one program be excluded for the other. There have to be made major design decisions here. I do not say it will not happen (I am sure it will), but I do think it will take some time. Do not forget that those programs that already incorporated ARA, did not had anything like VariAudio, so it was relatively easy to integrate ARA for their developers.

So - At the end I think we will get ARA (and I would like to see that), but I do think that it will not be in the short therm (although I would not mind to be wrong here).

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by TNM » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:40 am

i just don't see the issue sorry.. it could be integrated like Logic is doing.. it has it's Flex pitch and ARA2 (we are just waiting on the melodyne update).

Of course ditching vari audio is not an option and Steinberg would NEVER do such a thing. I can pretty much guarantee you that right now, and i certainly do not have any insider knowledge, not by a long shot. I am simply that sure variaudio is here to stay.

Not to mention, the way you can have variaudio vocals follow chords, etc.. this is all ingrained in Cubase.

But to *also* give the option of melodyne, why not? A user could choose.. an open with melodyne option. If one is already using vari audio, the solution would be to revert to original file and open in melodyne, or render the vari audio file then open in melodyne. If you are saying it will be difficult to use them concurrently, then of course.. i don't think that will happen, to say stretch a note in vari audio and pitch the same one in melodyne in realtime. In fact, i am as certain that that will never happen as i am that vari audio will always exist in Cubase.

I hope people realise, even at version 4, melodyne's pitch shift is not all that.. it never ever was.. Melodyne is great because it can do a lot of unusual things, but i have never been huge on the quality.. to be honest i still prefer waves tune over it, for pitch and vibrato.

And i think the quality of vari audio is at least as good as melodyne.

But it would be great to be able to access polyphonic audio to midi DNA... which is why i think (just IMO) ARA would be a terrific addition to speed up workflow. In the meantime, it's not killing me to capture audio via the melodyne plugin. It all works and never crashes.
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by TobyC » Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:33 pm

+1+++ to adding ARA support. Having worked with it in Sonar and having compared it with VariAudio I feel this is a 'must have' feature. Very important!

Now that Logic are coming on board it's even more urgent. If ProTools adds it then Cubase will be way, way behind the pack.

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by austinhaynesmusic » Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:14 pm

bump

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by Scrummy » Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:02 am

+1

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by B.Well » Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:39 pm

Very disappointed ARA is not in C9.5 Hoping it will be included in C10, and then I will upgrade.

Please Steiny. :)

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by jamesbmaxwell » Sun Apr 01, 2018 5:27 pm

+1

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by Scrummy » Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:51 pm

+1

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by JohnCty » Tue Apr 10, 2018 6:11 am

+1

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by stripealipe » Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:36 am

Whilst i can see having ARA would give the end user more options, i personally would like Steinberg to continue to work on Variaudio itself and refine its algorithms a little more and give us more options in terms of what algorithm gets used. Polyphonic support would be nice too..

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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by McBass » Sat Apr 14, 2018 1:10 am

While vari audio is a nice option it is not melodyne studio. Just like some OS built in paint program is not Adobe suite. Plus ARA is now on two other big name apps. I use vari audio sometimes but only because I am trying not to deal with the transfer hassle for a quick single note fix. Can you get good results? Sure. Is it as efficient and effective? No. I have plus one'ed this so many times it is ridiculous! Probably half my not so many posts! LOL
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by marQs » Sat Apr 14, 2018 10:25 am

Asked for ARA at Musikmesse. Was told that it's talked about at Steinberg, it will come. As more and more DAWs integrate it, Steinberg doesn't want to be retro 8-) The question is when, no idea about that.

Of course such information is vague but makes total sense. Any top of the line DAW can't ignore it in the long run simply.
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by McBass » Sat Apr 14, 2018 1:47 pm

Yeah just don't want to wait until Cubase 15 for it to be integrated and Cubase 17 for it to work right! LOL other DAWs seem to be moving forward faster on the development front.
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Re: Please add ARA integration

Post by austinhaynesmusic » Sun Apr 15, 2018 8:16 pm

Besides mentioning that Steinberg is talking about it, is there any idea on when we should expect it to show up in Cubase? Cubase 10?

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