TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by alexis » Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:18 pm

peakae wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:38 am
...
If you have an iPhone there are tons of Music calculators than can covert most music related things.
No iPhone here. No luck with Google for conversion of "per cent Varispeed slow down/speedup to cents/semitones".
Alexis

-Cubase "Safe Start Mode" (CTRL-ALT-SHIFT)
-Get variable-tempo audio to follow a grid here,
-Replacing freely-timed section into a variable tempo project

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by alexis » Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:19 pm

peakae wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:42 am
Oh btw, if I had a singer that had a problem getting up there, I would do a mixdown and slow that down tapestyle.
Once finished, speed up again and delete the mixdown track.
Right, thanks. I have done that in the past. Having one single knob to slow down/speed up the project instead, as mentioned above, does seem a lot nicer.

And it's not just for notes that can't be reached, it's for creative purposes as well, examples given of Beatles tuning up 1-2 half steps for a different timbre.
Alexis

-Cubase "Safe Start Mode" (CTRL-ALT-SHIFT)
-Get variable-tempo audio to follow a grid here,
-Replacing freely-timed section into a variable tempo project

Cubase 9.0.20; i5-4570 3.2GHz, 16GB RAM; W10 Pro 64-bit on Samsung SSD 840 Pro 256GB; Seagate 1TB SATA 600 Audio; UR28M; Motif8; UAD-2 Solo; Jamstix 3.6; RevoicePro3.3; EZDrummer 2

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by digi001 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:18 pm

alexis wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:18 pm
peakae wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:38 am
...
If you have an iPhone there are tons of Music calculators than can covert most music related things.
No iPhone here. No luck with Google for conversion of "per cent Varispeed slow down/speedup to cents/semitones".
Alexis....I did find what you need.
http://www.thewhippinpost.co.uk/tools/t ... ulator.htm

BPM to Semitones and Semitone to BPM, is what you are looking for.

HOWEVER we still want it in the DAW!
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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by -steve- » Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:33 pm

Wow. This topic has been completely hijacked, so I will continue the hijacking.

Even though the OP asked for a single knob to control tempo, people are asking for different things here- all of it involves changing the playback speed using the tape algo, but the purpose is different.

My workaround is for recording at a slower tempo in a project with a tempo changes in the tempo track:

Create a new track version of the tempo track by duplicating the existing one.
Scale the entire tempo track slower

Now you can switch between the two tempi using track versions. (make sure all tracks you want to change tempo for are set to Musical Time Base)
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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by peakae » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:26 pm

I think we all agree that a single speed knob is a good idea, tape-style and otherwise.
So to be clear
+1
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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by alexis » Fri Sep 15, 2017 3:34 am

digi001 wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:18 pm
...

Alexis....I did find what you need.
http://www.thewhippinpost.co.uk/tools/t ... ulator.htm

BPM to Semitones and Semitone to BPM, is what you are looking for.
Awesome! ... Great job!! .... Thank you!!!

digi001 wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:18 pm
HOWEVER we still want it in the DAW!
Yes! Saves the big project bounce.

Thanks again!
Alexis

-Cubase "Safe Start Mode" (CTRL-ALT-SHIFT)
-Get variable-tempo audio to follow a grid here,
-Replacing freely-timed section into a variable tempo project

Cubase 9.0.20; i5-4570 3.2GHz, 16GB RAM; W10 Pro 64-bit on Samsung SSD 840 Pro 256GB; Seagate 1TB SATA 600 Audio; UR28M; Motif8; UAD-2 Solo; Jamstix 3.6; RevoicePro3.3; EZDrummer 2

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by MrSoundman » Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:51 pm

alexis wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:18 pm
peakae wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:38 am
...
If you have an iPhone there are tons of Music calculators than can covert most music related things.
No iPhone here. No luck with Google for conversion of "per cent Varispeed slow down/speedup to cents/semitones".
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Calculations03.htm
Windows 10 • Cubase 10.5.0 • WaveLab 10.0.0 • SpectraLayers 6.0.20 • HALion 6.3.1 • Groove Agent 5.0.20 • Midex

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by MrSoundman » Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:55 pm

MrSoundman wrote:
Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:51 pm
alexis wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:18 pm
peakae wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:38 am
...
If you have an iPhone there are tons of Music calculators than can covert most music related things.
No iPhone here. No luck with Google for conversion of "per cent Varispeed slow down/speedup to cents/semitones".
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Calculations03.htm
Soory, wrong link, but they're both very useful!
http://mp3.deepsound.net/eng/samples_calculs.php
Windows 10 • Cubase 10.5.0 • WaveLab 10.0.0 • SpectraLayers 6.0.20 • HALion 6.3.1 • Groove Agent 5.0.20 • Midex

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by alexis » Fri Sep 15, 2017 4:48 pm

MrSoundman wrote:
Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:55 pm
MrSoundman wrote:
Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:51 pm
alexis wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:18 pm


No iPhone here. No luck with Google for conversion of "per cent Varispeed slow down/speedup to cents/semitones".
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Calculations03.htm
Soory, wrong link, but they're both very useful!
http://mp3.deepsound.net/eng/samples_calculs.php
Yes indeed! Thank you, Mr. Soundman!
Alexis

-Cubase "Safe Start Mode" (CTRL-ALT-SHIFT)
-Get variable-tempo audio to follow a grid here,
-Replacing freely-timed section into a variable tempo project

Cubase 9.0.20; i5-4570 3.2GHz, 16GB RAM; W10 Pro 64-bit on Samsung SSD 840 Pro 256GB; Seagate 1TB SATA 600 Audio; UR28M; Motif8; UAD-2 Solo; Jamstix 3.6; RevoicePro3.3; EZDrummer 2

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by Stephen57 » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:53 pm

Brandy wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:00 pm
Stephen57 wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:58 pm
Brandy wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:27 pm


Thats something completely different and has nothing do do with the Varispeed thing :)
Playback of what? And if it's completely different, please explain.

well, these time stretch options are more or less for editing events - for fixing performance as well as for creativity etc.

The varispeed we are talking about is some kind of a "master speed override" which enables us to playback the full project (incl EVERYTHING) in a different speed - when tape machine style then with altered pitch as well... This can be useful for:

- creativity/sound (like digi001 described)
- for recording complex stuff in a bit lowered tempo (not always a good thing to do but sometimes it can be handy)
- for recording vocals which are a bit out of range of the singer (just record it slower/lower - often just a bit does the trick)

all these things were some kind of "butter and bread" in days of tape recording - they had basically nothing but THIS was possible :)
In our case we basically have everything - but this is not possible :)

in my case there is another kind of use:

- for practicing new material, I am a drummer, I often have to play fast and complex stuff, maybe prior to recording it.. so lets have the playback 20% slowed down, learn it, practice, now only 10% down... practice.. then regular speed, practice and record it.
I tried to use Logic on my macbook for this but it is too complicated/time consuming to transfer all the stuff from Cubase to Logic.. and I still do not have a clue about using Logic :-)
Brandy, thanks for a very clear answer. I can see where this kind of program feature might be interesting.

However, for nearly every use you mention, apart from creative sound design with Veri-speed tape-style material a la George Martin, shall we say, I have been able to do nearly everything you mention with the features Cubase provides, along with some additional 3rd party plug-ins, instruments and sample material. A more audio-based approached would make this kind tempo/pitch tape-style operation a good feature to have if needed, but, at least for me, it is not a top priority and its absence is not an impediment to my work. Perhaps we can talk about some of this in another thread in the Lounge at some point. I think it's an interesting idea. The Laws of Media say that a new communications technology will retrieve and enhance aspects of the one it replaces. Perhaps, as Cubase advances it will retrieve more of the good things linear tape recording offered, and, in doing so, further obsolete the magnetic tape medium -- which, for good or ill, is nearly extinct now. Time will tell. https://www.provenmodels.com/18/four-la ... ll-mcluhan

I find it interesting to see the many different ways people use Cubase. Thanks for taking the time to post.
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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by Stephen57 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:04 am

digi001 wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 3:38 pm
Stephen57 wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 7:10 pm
digi001 wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:37 pm


I should clarify....I'm not sure you understand my application.

I AM trying to use this just like a Tape Machine.

Not trying to do a Tape Drop FX.
Not trying to time warp every single audio file in my project, record something, then un-warp every audio file back. (would also include converting any Midi files to audio first)

I record my 'Actual' Synths using Audio channels. They are hardware synths.

I slow the entire track down to something like -5 semitones or -12 semitones. Play the part on the synth -5 semitones or -12 semitones as well on the keyboard, then speed it all back up. (works cool sometimes the other way too) In the same vein of the piano part on the track 'In my life' by the Beatles if you ever heard of them ;)

*I actually switched to Logic 9/X and used this for a few years solely because of the Tape-Style varispeed and 1 or 2 other features. It's really important to me and part of my workflow.

Now sometimes I will have a Piano or Electric Piano or other World Sound as MIDI in my project since I don't have space or own these instruments. What is great about the Logic X varispeed is that it pitches these down as well during varispeed.
What's the purpose of doing this?
For synths.... it's mostly a trick of being able to play it fast enough, but still be human and have a groove. (Makes it kind of sound like early electronica BBC, not the new crap). Sometimes the sound will change (if it has alot of contour and vibrato, but otherwise sometimes cant hear a difference)

For most other stuff, it totally changes the timbre of the sound.
digi001, I see. It's an interesting idea however, for me, it's not a top priority. Maybe in the future this kind of feature will be made part of Cubase, variable speed was one of the good things about linear tape in terms of it being used as a creative medium. Anyway, thanks for answering and explaining this a bit more.
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DAW: Cubase Pro 10 (Main), Cubase Pro 9.5 (Backup); PC: HP Z230, i5 CPU quad-core 3.5 Ghz, 16 Gigs RAM; OS: Win 7 Pro 64-bit; Audio Converters, Scarlett 2I4, Zoom UCR-8; USB MIDI Controller, Akai Advance 49. VST-Is: Spectrasonics Omnisphere 2.5, Stylus RMX; Air Music: Hybrid, Transfuser 2, Vacuum Pro, Velvet, Xpand2; Novation: Bass Station; Sonovox Grand Piano; Rack: Proteus 2000, Korg 03R/W, Yamaha TG 33. Monitoring with KRK Rokit 8/G3, Tannoy PBM 6.5 II, Mics. Scheops, Sennheiser, Rode, Lectrosonics RF, etc.

Help with Cubase:
Documentation: https://steinberg.help/
Location/file paths of presets in Cubase and Nuendo: https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... nd-Nuendo-
Preferences: https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... and-Nuendo

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by Stephen57 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:09 am

-steve- wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:33 pm
Wow. This topic has been completely hijacked, so I will continue the hijacking.

Even though the OP asked for a single knob to control tempo, people are asking for different things here- all of it involves changing the playback speed using the tape algo, but the purpose is different.

My workaround is for recording at a slower tempo in a project with a tempo changes in the tempo track:

Create a new track version of the tempo track by duplicating the existing one.
Scale the entire tempo track slower

Now you can switch between the two tempi using track versions. (make sure all tracks you want to change tempo for are set to Musical Time Base)
Excellent method, Steve.
-------------------------------------------------------
DAW: Cubase Pro 10 (Main), Cubase Pro 9.5 (Backup); PC: HP Z230, i5 CPU quad-core 3.5 Ghz, 16 Gigs RAM; OS: Win 7 Pro 64-bit; Audio Converters, Scarlett 2I4, Zoom UCR-8; USB MIDI Controller, Akai Advance 49. VST-Is: Spectrasonics Omnisphere 2.5, Stylus RMX; Air Music: Hybrid, Transfuser 2, Vacuum Pro, Velvet, Xpand2; Novation: Bass Station; Sonovox Grand Piano; Rack: Proteus 2000, Korg 03R/W, Yamaha TG 33. Monitoring with KRK Rokit 8/G3, Tannoy PBM 6.5 II, Mics. Scheops, Sennheiser, Rode, Lectrosonics RF, etc.

Help with Cubase:
Documentation: https://steinberg.help/
Location/file paths of presets in Cubase and Nuendo: https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... nd-Nuendo-
Preferences: https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... and-Nuendo

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by MrSoundman » Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:27 am

MrSoundman wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:45 pm
For entire tracks, I prefer to do it for free with Paul's Extreme Sound Stretch.
I have to mention this again because it really is a neat little tool ... I know you'd have to render a track, run it through this etc., but for the amount of times I've had to do this, it's really not a problem. You really have to try this out, if only for the fun of it! (it's not really free -- we should donate to support these developers who solve such problems!)
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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by Stephen57 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:38 pm

MrSoundman wrote:
Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:27 am
MrSoundman wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:45 pm
For entire tracks, I prefer to do it for free with Paul's Extreme Sound Stretch.
I have to mention this again because it really is a neat little tool ... I know you'd have to render a track, run it through this etc., but for the amount of times I've had to do this, it's really not a problem. You really have to try this out, if only for the fun of it! (it's not really free -- we should donate to support these developers who solve such problems!)
I noted that link and will most likely try this program at some point. Thanks for mentioning it.
-------------------------------------------------------
DAW: Cubase Pro 10 (Main), Cubase Pro 9.5 (Backup); PC: HP Z230, i5 CPU quad-core 3.5 Ghz, 16 Gigs RAM; OS: Win 7 Pro 64-bit; Audio Converters, Scarlett 2I4, Zoom UCR-8; USB MIDI Controller, Akai Advance 49. VST-Is: Spectrasonics Omnisphere 2.5, Stylus RMX; Air Music: Hybrid, Transfuser 2, Vacuum Pro, Velvet, Xpand2; Novation: Bass Station; Sonovox Grand Piano; Rack: Proteus 2000, Korg 03R/W, Yamaha TG 33. Monitoring with KRK Rokit 8/G3, Tannoy PBM 6.5 II, Mics. Scheops, Sennheiser, Rode, Lectrosonics RF, etc.

Help with Cubase:
Documentation: https://steinberg.help/
Location/file paths of presets in Cubase and Nuendo: https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... nd-Nuendo-
Preferences: https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... and-Nuendo

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by agrpap » Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:10 pm

Record at higher speed, playback at normal speed or vice-versa. The audio recorded will have a different character. Great for thicker guitars and whatnot. The time stretch function doesn't do it.

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by agrpap » Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:15 pm

9.5 out now. No Varispeed. I give up.

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Re: TAPE-STYLE VARISPEED

Post by Musicmould » Sat Sep 28, 2019 11:15 am

Logic Pro has had Varispeed built in for quite some time. ;)
Awesome implementation as well. You can choose to affect speed only or pitch as well.

For instance, slow it down to be able to do that almost impossible guitar solo.
Adjust pitch as well and double the guitar and you've got a magic sound for the guitar.
Or vocal. Or rap or...
Simply awesome for the pure joy of creativity.

I switch to Logic every now and then just to be able to do it.

Would love to see it in Cubase, though.
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