[CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Tue Jul 17, 2018 11:15 am

one of my projects won't load before I disable those multiout tracks while its inactive, then load it up and activate them manually again
what a nice new workflow, steinberg.
never happened in 8.5
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Tue Jul 17, 2018 7:32 pm

kavinsky wrote:
Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:41 am
Have you tried hosting those tracks inside vepro?
Thats the only solution I can think of but its a hassle and requers an additional purchase
To get it in perspective, AFAIK all these problems only happen when a track has been disabled and re-enabled. Cubase can host a VST, it's only that this additional functionality breaks stuff.

(Will stand corrected if anyone has experience of these buys on tracks that have never been disabled).
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Wed Jul 18, 2018 5:33 pm

thats correct. only disabled tracks or imported tracks
I don't understand why they cannot be recalled properly.
because if you open the project where the tracks were created or never disabled, it works fine.

right now I do the following
1.import/enable the track. all messed up
2.duplicate the track and switch off multiouts on the new one
3.switch them on again
4.copy/paste all the plugin settings and routing/levels from the messed up one
5.delete the messed up track

I guess if they could implement this crooked approach under the hood as a temprorary fix, that would be nice

PS The main thing I completely fail to understand is why the hell if I duplicate the healthy multiout track inside the project, its duplicated without any issues!
it seems like it could be fixed in half an hour.
I'd really appreciate an official comment though. they are not even returning emails.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Wed Aug 01, 2018 2:35 pm

"Thanks for contacting the Steinberg Technical Support.
We are sorry for the delay, we are facing an unusual amount of requests.

Please note that the issue will be addressed in the next Cubase Update.

Regards,

Eric Chabane
Technical Support Representative"

I'll just leave it here
Hopefully it happens sooner than C10 in december.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:59 pm

WHOAAAA!

Sooner rather than later would be wonderful, but soooooo good to hear they've got a fix. Thanks for posting Kavinsky.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Wed Aug 01, 2018 11:59 pm

I hope it wasnt just to brush me off haha
They also said they can't give a rough timeframe for the update release.
Lets wait for the next 9.5.xx and see, fingers crossed
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Thu Aug 02, 2018 9:06 am

I'll be watching - I have bought an update from 9.0 to the next version that I haven't activated. Was planning to wait til 10 (or longer if there had been no improvements here nor to Track Presets), but if 9.5 gets fixed I might just jump in earlier.

Someone elsewhere reckoned its been 3 years waiting to fix this...
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Sat Sep 29, 2018 2:24 pm

oh looks like they're going to push the update all the way up to december and release it with v10.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Mon Oct 01, 2018 4:34 pm

kavinsky wrote:
Sat Sep 29, 2018 2:24 pm
oh looks like they're going to push the update all the way up to december and release it with v10.
What's that based on Kavinsky? Suits me ok (so long as its finally fixed!), but just curious if you have additional info.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Tue Oct 02, 2018 12:24 am

noiseboyuk wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 4:34 pm


What's that based on Kavinsky? Suits me ok (so long as its finally fixed!), but just curious if you have additional info.
Hey Guy
Just an assumption I'm afraid, I checked the update history for the previous couple of versions and its always been like that
they release the next version and do the major update to the previous one to close it off.

But yes, as long as its fixed, I'm fine with waiting.
Not 3 years more though
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Tue Oct 16, 2018 3:12 pm

No mention of a fix I can see in 9.5.40 - I'm still on 9.0.x can someone with the update confirm?
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by Larioso » Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:48 pm

I didn't see it mentioned either - that fit this problem.

I updated yesterday and will see if I get a chance to look at this today. Though my issues getting seriously twisted order of outs and weird error messages - is not related to disabled tracks, but guess it's part of the same problem. Mine seemed to be related to picking random tracks including SD2 from a project and save as archive that got all twisted if used even in a blank project later. If I did the same thing from a minimum project where tracks were in order - it worked fine as workaround inserting into any project.

- I'll be back....
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Fri Oct 19, 2018 4:49 pm

YES!!!!!!!!!!!
on the first try in a blank project importing tracks works!
I know its not 100% yet, but it definitely behaves differently - it loads the tracks a lot longer now (which I'm completely fine with as long as it works)
and you can actually see how they load one by one. that wasnt the case before

so far I've imported around 15 tracks and they are all looking good, which never happened before, so I'm pretty much sure they fixed it
I tried disabling/reenabling those and it worked aswell

I'll report back after I try and import some tracks into my super heavy project, but so far so good!
Will let you know
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:50 pm

EDIT - I hate to say it but in a busy project it works like crap - same usual mess as always.
goddamnit

I will try to make a clean 9.5.40 project to really test it out. Maybe the old projects still pick up those old settings who knows

but it looks like they didn't do jacksh!t to fix it.
Its not in the update logs either.
Last edited by kavinsky on Fri Oct 19, 2018 7:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Fri Oct 19, 2018 7:05 pm

Thanks hugely for the reports, kavinsky. It's entirely possible that a fix only applies to newly made archives or tracks. I've been holding off making anything but essential changes for a while for this reason, it could be a case of starting from scratch. But obviously we'd need to know it would then be 100% rugged, not just wasting a phenomenal amount of time and effort.

It is still odd that Steinberg haven't published any change in status for this problem, when they said it would be fixed in the next update and behaviour does seem to have changed.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Fri Oct 19, 2018 7:09 pm

It definitely was working differently when I tried it in the blank project.
It was loading them one by one as I said

But in the old project it just loads them exactly like before - very fast and with kontakt loading screen for a splitsecond
I will try and transfer this busy project into the blank one just to see if it works. tomorrow

yes its not in the update history pdf, which leads me to believe they just ignored it once again

PS - just tried importing from a different project into a blank one and its the same old mess.
Nothing was done I'm 100% positive.
I'm going to ask the support why they brushed me off with promises they couldn't keep
Its so disappointing. They will probably "assure" me that it will be fixed in the next one.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:32 pm

Ah, ok. I remember some discussion at the time as to whether or not they meant the next full release (ie C10) or next point update. Good luck getting a response out of them!

I do hope C10 contains SOMETHING, some improvement in some way or other. I'm willing to change my workflow - if Track Presets got useful with full routings and were reliable, I'd jump all over those instead of Track Archives. In fact I'd prefer them.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by Larioso » Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:37 am

Sadly they fixed nothing regarding my reordered 7 stereo outputs either - both in project windows as automation lanes and in mixer.
And there are extra black automation lanes as well, what ever those are. No text in controls, but seem to be able to remove separately.
What is normal automation lanes I have red color on instrument tracks, so they differ.
What is different now is that I don't get error message boxes talking about missing tracks or similar.
It's now three years in december I made my report on this, which just vanished in Steinberg's ticket system - no sign of it.

I saved main instrument track(23) and a group track(31) and it's a mess when loaded from archive alter.
This was SuperiorDrummer2.x

I have other instruments that have multiple outs like BlueCatAudio Patchwork, and it shows as many extra black automation lanes as doubled to normal ones with no text in controls, not functioning normally. You can mark and remove it seems though. But doesn't feel right to use it project you import into - since this mess might be in there somehow - whatever that is that is making it interpret xml info wrong. If you later have serious issues with a regular huge project - it's not worth it.

Everything saved arhive with 9.5.40 create an extra automation lane from the main instrument name when loaded.
Not the end of the world though, you can mark and remove that one.

My workaround consisted of a template project where those tracks saved in archive are consequtive track no, if that is what makes a differnce.

Looking inside xml of archive, this is impossible for the non programmer to interpret the amount of various data in there.

Maybe we can hope for a 9.5.45 before end of year - fixing some other issues people seems to be having with 9.5.40.
Otherwise 9.5.40 seems ok by me.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:53 am

Very similar to my issues, Larioso.

Incidentally, I can only presume that only a tiny percentage of Cubase users currently use Track Archives or Multi Out Instrument tracks, or else nobody would talk about anything else on this forum.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by Larioso » Sat Oct 20, 2018 8:55 am

Yes, I felt immediately when you started this thread - it's the same issue.

I guess many did not use archives, maybe because there is nothing called "export tracks as archive", just "Export selected tracks".
There is only "archive" for import - and most of us wonder - WTF is that - and ignore it?
The niceness is all the routings that are kept etc.
You can use for multi mike setups ready to go, or multi instruments setups and incredible time saving features - you repeat from time to time.

And all other daws call it track templates - and it just works.

And as you said earlier - track presets could be developed further to fix the routings as well. But the multi track presets is a mess, kind of, how you have to know where you apply them, on the same kind of track, so not fully thought through, I think. Any missing tracks should just be created from the preset. Drag a multi track preset to empty project space - and wooosh and it's all there for you - then all is forgiven. ;)
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Sat Oct 20, 2018 9:19 am

I'm pretty sure track archive/drag-n-drop tracks is the same thing essentially.
Don't know about track presets but what a hassle it would be to save all the presets if you could just import or dragndrop the tracks you need from another project.
It doesn't matter how many people are using it, it should be working properly like in every other DAW.
The most depressing thing is that they've aknowledged the issue and promised to fix it and didn't deliver.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Wed Oct 24, 2018 1:53 pm

OK. So Steinberg suggested to reinitialise preferences
I'm going to try it later today

"Did you initialise Cubase preferences after having updated Cubase ?
Mac:
https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... n-Mac-OS-X
Windows:
https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... on-Windows"
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by Larioso » Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:35 pm

Thanks for the feedback.
Looking forward to hear result.

If Cubase first write tracks to archive xml and then fail to restore them to be the same 5 minutes later - no update in between - seems far fetched to me that preferences are involved. Unless you have plenty other issues like stability or something. But for me 9.5 is a rock, no sign to even wobble.
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by noiseboyuk » Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:36 pm

Yes, similarly sceptical (and doubly so since they didn't list anything in the changelog) but hoping against hope...
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Re: [CAN-13042] Multi out instrument tracks still broken after disabling PLEASE RESPOND STEINBERG

Post by kavinsky » Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:29 am

I'm farily sceptical aswell, but we have to keep the thread/dialogue active so they don't ever forget about it.
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