Cubase 10 Features

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Cubase 10 Features

Post by Eneco » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:17 pm

Hey everybody,

with every new Cubase release it's the same story: the superior big brother Nuendo gets nothing and has to wait!

As this upset many Nuendo users there was a a long discussion about this topic with the release of Nuendo 8 last year. As a result Steinberg wanted to bring the release dates of the two DAWs closer together as well as get Cubase features faster over to Nuendo.

So with this in mind I wanted to know when we can expect this to happen?

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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by lumcas » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:15 pm

+1 on this one, many features all really useful judging from Cubase 10 videos. I'd expect Steinberg to address their "flagship" users concerns kind of... without asking. My bad.

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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Wed Nov 14, 2018 8:26 pm

We already have the most important features from C10, they are taken from Nuendo. (AAF, edit mode, auto align.)
The only thing that is really important imho is ARA2 for revoice pro and most likely auto align post vst that is a VERY desirable plugin only available to PT users at the moment.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by paaltio » Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:10 pm

Oliver.Lucas wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 8:26 pm
We already have the most important features from C10, they are taken from Nuendo. (AAF, edit mode, auto align.)
Well if they keep this up, I don’t need to pay for Nuendo anymore!
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:01 am

paaltio wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:10 pm

Well if they keep this up, I don’t need to pay for Nuendo anymore!
I personally think that the opposite is true: If we want Steinberg to keep up doing proper Nuendo updates we need to pay more...
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by ChrisPolus » Thu Nov 15, 2018 11:55 pm

I liked the UI redesign a lot and I'll be happy when it comes to Nuendo at some point in time. Those enhancements look and feel great in usability from what I've seen.

Now only the damned eLicenser has to say goodbye. Then I'll be really happy :) Go Steinberg
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Dog and Pony » Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:26 am

Looking at those videos left me wondering if perhaps they're starting the process of creating a single DAW with tiers rather than two major DAW's. Purely speculation. john
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Rkmusic » Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:44 am

Dog and Pony wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:26 am
Looking at those videos left me wondering if perhaps they're starting the process of creating a single DAW with tiers rather than two major DAW's. Purely speculation. john
I agree! I don’t think nuendo is doing good in the market. That’s just my guess, Cubase has a bigger market and can reach way more people in the industry. If Cubase keeps adding legit features it can cover way more ground than nuendo. Just my opinion of course.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by ChrisPolus » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:06 pm

In one of their teaser promo videos of the Cubase 10 launch event one of the guys even said (and they deliberately left it in their promo video) "I switched from Nuendo to Cubase because it now has all I need for my workflow" or something along those lines. Suspicious :)
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by DaniDonadi » Sat Nov 17, 2018 10:09 pm

Cubase Pro 10 (For music producers, composers....)
Cubase Pro 10 HD (Everything CB10 is + PostProd tools, video games features AND tabbed multiple sequences in one project, a la Digital Performer).

One can always dream, right?

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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by uarte » Sun Nov 18, 2018 11:05 pm

Rkmusic wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:44 am
Dog and Pony wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:26 am
Looking at those videos left me wondering if perhaps they're starting the process of creating a single DAW with tiers rather than two major DAW's. Purely speculation. john
I agree! I don’t think nuendo is doing good in the market. That’s just my guess, Cubase has a bigger market and can reach way more people in the industry. If Cubase keeps adding legit features it can cover way more ground than nuendo. Just my opinion of course.
I read somewhere (perhaps from one of the mods) that the Nuendo product is self-sustaining financially and I recall he said it is making money. Now whether or not that's exaggeration or marketing is another issue, but as I understand it, each business/product unit in Steinberg has its own revenue stream and development process, even if they share components. And given that they've already made some changes to Nuendo (i.e. merging in the NEK features), and Nuendo's recent success in the game dev market, it seems that it is unlikely that they are going to merge it with Cubase any time soon. If anything, I think it is really here to stay. They just launched Nuendo Live 2 as well, so the "Nuendo" brand is something they seem to be committing to.

Cubase and Nuendo obviously share a lot of the same codebase, and sometimes Cubase gets things from Nuendo, and sometimes Nuendo gets things from Cubase. I suspect we'll get all the Cubase 10 features by Nuendo 8.5, plus some new goodies. Just a matter of time. And I'm not sure it's a good idea to get all the new Cubase 10 features right away anyway, since there are often lots of bugs to be worked out. I hate to say it, but the quality control on Cubase does not seem as robust as that of Nuendo. Cubase 10 has new multi-thread/core improvements that probably need more time to be tested before moving over to mission-critical Nuendo environments anyway.

One of the big headline features is of course ARA support... which is still forthcoming in Cubase. I suspect that when the Cubase 10 update is released with ARA support, Nuendo 8.5 (guessing at version number) will be released in close proximity to it... so both will have ARA support at nearly the same time. It would be VERY frustrating to Nuendo users to have to wait very long for ARA support, now that it is known that Steinberg has been working on it. Perhaps they delayed ARA support for Cubsase 10 just for this reason alone... at least until Nuendo 8.5 is released.

My two bits...

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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by OnBeat » Mon Nov 19, 2018 12:38 am

I have a Nuendo and Cubase license. Cubase was used at home and Nuendo at my studio. Cubase now has most of the Nuendo features I was used to in music production and mixing so I switched my Nuendo to home use until it catches up.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Fredo » Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:34 am

But, the new Nuendo version will have a bunch of new Nuendo-exclusive features ....
Fredo

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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by uarte » Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:47 pm

Fredo wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:34 am
But, the new Nuendo version will have a bunch of new Nuendo-exclusive features ....
Fredo
Yes, agreed, but I do hope they take a break from game dev stuff and focus on film post people again.

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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by MattiasNYC » Mon Nov 19, 2018 4:57 pm

Merging the two would probably be a headache technically as well as in terms of dealing with customers. Just the different implementation of VCAs would make backwards compatibility a nightmare.

As a comment on the recent direction of the apps and the GUI specifically I have to say I feel there's a bit of wasted space there that I really don't care for at all. The area that makes up the "borders" between sections seem to take up unnecessary space. I like a simple visible single line dividing two sections, not nice curves or anything that then decreases usable space. It looks cluttered to me.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by OnBeat » Mon Nov 19, 2018 7:06 pm

Fredo wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:34 am
But, the new Nuendo version will have a bunch of new Nuendo-exclusive features ....
Fredo
I love Nuendo and got it as a crossgrade back in the Cubase SX days so I never used it as a post program. I would rather use the new Cubase features now than wait another 3-6 months for Nuendo to catch up. When it does, I'll switch again as I like the visuals in Nuendo better. The improved audio align, Variaudio 3 and better graphic performance in Windows 10 are a God send.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Tue Nov 20, 2018 11:48 am

uarte wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:47 pm

Yes, agreed, but I do hope they take a break from game dev stuff and focus on film post people again.
I have the feeling that I should not hold my breath...

8.3 clearly shows how much they have given up on audio post users.

I have today ordered a reinstatement for PT Ultimate 12.10 and will use the unexpected free weeks I have at the moment to get up to speed with the software.
If it does what I need I've been a Nuendo user from version 3 to 8.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Timeline » Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:02 pm

Hi Oliver, you will be missed than as a pro user of Nuendo, we are far too few. I'm a bit confused by your sentiment and what you actually feel is lacking for film audio post. With a build in reconformer, ADR/foley taker. amazing built in surround mixing support, built in media bay (close enough to Basehead and soundminer for SFX spotting needs in the box), a myriad of in the box plugs that rival close enough to 3rd parties at high price points, new field recorder workflow in the work (hopefully coming soon with ARA support), DOP (huge time saver for dialogue editing here), network features (so great for working on a large scale film projects with other sound editors), and much more of course. Nuendo has been used here on close to 20 pictures and we dont feel like PT would ever be an option for us as quite frankly it would be a step back. Just without the slip edit feature I would be lost not too mention DOP. What would I have to do when DX editing. Render down each clip after I applied audio suite, what if I want to adjust something I did days ago - oh I guess start over. I doubt you will get what you need from it. best of luck
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Alex Motylev » Tue Nov 20, 2018 5:12 pm

I think I am going to use Nuendo 7 for as long as I can. I didn't like changes in 8, but I had a hope that things will change. After looking at Cubase 10 my hope is lost :(

Oliver, there is really good video about automation in pro tools that helped me a lot.

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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Tue Nov 20, 2018 5:44 pm

Alex Motylev wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 5:12 pm
I think I am going to use Nuendo 7 for as long as I can. I didn't like changes in 8, but I had a hope that things will change. After looking at Cubase 10 my hope is lost :(

Oliver, there is really good video about automation in pro tools that helped me a lot.
Thanks Alex !
I am aware of that excellent video - the automation with snapshot features is actually one of the reasons for my decision. It is a lot closer to what I expect to be able to do than the Nuendo automation. I had requested automation snapshots for probably a decade in Nuendo.
Nevertheless my first day showed quite a steep learning curve and I already know that I will miss multiple marker tracks in PT.
It's going to be an exciting time until next year, especially since I will need to switch between N8 and PT12U for learning days and productive days quite a lot.
I'm prepared to be continuously hitting the wrong key commands and quite a bit of head scratching in the near future...
Again, thanks for the link.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by ChrisPolus » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:15 am

MattiasNYC wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 4:57 pm
I feel there's a bit of wasted space there that I really don't care for at all. The area that makes up the "borders" between sections seem to take up unnecessary space.
Although it's not the C10 forum, nor a feature request, nor do I think Steinberg people are interested in this... I do agree.

I like the new GUI a lot better, it's a great step in the right direction (to me). It seems they did some clever clickflow enhancements, which I really like and complained a lot about in my early posts on this forum. Those changes are really welcome. I also know it's kind of a "signature" UI thing to have those sections expand and collapse in the track inspector, but to me it also looks cluttered.

I quickly put 3 inspectors side by side for comparison.
Left: Cubase 10 (scaled, I didn't have my iLok with me so I took a screenshot from their promo video)
Mid: Reaper
Right: Logic
Channel Inspector.jpg
(203.84 KiB) Not downloaded yet

Of those, I like Reaper the least. It's super tiny, hard to read, bad contrast, but takes the smallest space. Arguably, taking too little space prevents you from seeing and reading anything if you're on a large screen and sitting a bit away. It also has the least amount of info.

Cubase 10 wastes a lot of space with its sections, lines around things, spaces between sections and all the expand/collapse mumbo jumbo. It looks nice but it has huge boxes that take space and don't have any real informational value.

Of those, I like Logic the most. Although it doesn't have all the adjustments Cubase (or Nuendo) have to offer, I think I see the most important stuff at a glance. I see technical adjustments (for MIDI in this case) at the top, which I still can expand to see more if I like. I see Hardware Input, Input Gain, Channel Config, EQ Curve, Plugin Inserts, Sends, Output Routing, Automation Mode, Pan, Meters, Fader AND the channel I'm routing audio to with its configuration all in one glance.

Sure, I could expand all section in Nuendo, but this would mean a lot of scrolling. Or I would need to click a lot to open the sections I want and Nuendo auto-closes the others. Or I could have the mixer open to look at some info, but this uses even more space.

Anyway, just an observation. Not that it would impact what you can do with the software of course (I could hear Fredo's annoyed sighing all the way down here in Switzerland :D ), but the eyes have to travel a lot more to see the things I would like to keep an eye on.

Nevertheless I'm really excited for those UI and workflow features finding their way into Nuendo.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Rkmusic » Wed Nov 21, 2018 3:08 am

@oliver I’m pretty sure you’ll be fine after a couple days with pro tools. It’s a great software, if pro tools performance was good with virtual instruments I would never leave pro tools to be honest.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by MattiasNYC » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:05 am

ChrisPolus wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:15 am
I quickly put 3 inspectors side by side for comparison.
I see what you mean and I don't disagree.

I was actually talking about the borders between the different sections however. So, the borders between the inspector and the main window, and the right pane, the lower panel etc.... You can see it in your screenshot in the upper right corner where the white outline curves below the word "Visibility".

I found the following photo:

https://www.amazona.de/wp-content/uploa ... istory.png

It's the same thing where between the panes on the left/right and the top/bottom sections there's a bit of space and the edges between them are rounded. To me it looks a bit like a loss of space, but more importantly (to me) it makes the whole software look "disjointed" and less integrated.

If I'm looking at the "History" pane to the left for example and then count the amount of lines on its right side until I actually get to the insert slots I count a total of five 'lines';

- the bright edge of the "History" pane's rightmost edge
- a dark area
- another bright edge
- then the same color as in the "History" window's background
- another bright edge...

And then the exact same thing on the right side of the insert section.

To me that's just too much.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by Rkmusic » Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:24 am

@mattias you know what else is annoying? We’ll at least annoying to me, I can’t hide the tool bar in the Mixconsole.
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Re: Cubase 10 Features

Post by ChrisPolus » Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:59 pm

MattiasNYC wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:05 am
- the bright edge of the "History" pane's rightmost edge
- a dark area
- another bright edge
- then the same color as in the "History" window's background
- another bright edge...
ok, now i get what you mean and I agree here, too. it's potentially useful space that makes the UI unsteady and irritates the eyes. It doesn't guide the eyes well. And one could tighten it up and see more useful stuff. Yep.
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