Explanation Midi fader?

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charlesvk
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Explanation Midi fader?

Post by charlesvk » Mon Mar 25, 2013 7:28 pm

Well, probably a newby thing:

Let´s say I use Halion 4 multitimbral, have slot 1 getting its data from midi track 1 and routed to output 1 (master);
have slot 2 getting its data from midi track 2, routed to output 2, etc.

Now in the mixconsole, I´ve got both a midi fader and an audio fader for each slot. The midi fader is turned down all the way by default, yet I get a read out and the signal is going to the audio fader and the volume ajustable there.

Couple of questions:

1. As soon as I touch the midi fader, I influence the volume. When I turn it back down completely, I don´t get back to the default state where the signal was coming through, the channel is silent; no more read out. Is the midi fader a fader usually left untouched? Best to hide those in the Mixconsole to avoid confusion and just use the audio fader?
2. When the midi fader is turned up 100% the midi notes on the track are not hitting volume 127. There still is dynamic range. Why is that? What´s the use then: if I want things louder, I can turn the audio fader up?
3. I forgot... :D Will post it when I remember.

I hope someone can explain this.

Kind regards,

Charles
Dell XPS Studio 8100 i7 860@2.80GHz, 16GB RAM, W7 Ultimate SP1 64-bit, Motu 828mk3, Cubase 8.0.5 64-bit

-steve-
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Re: Explanation Midi fader?

Post by -steve- » Mon Mar 25, 2013 7:47 pm

charlesvk wrote: 1. As soon as I touch the midi fader, I influence the volume. When I turn it back down completely, I don´t get back to the default state where the signal was coming through, the channel is silent; no more read out. Is the midi fader a fader usually left untouched? Best to hide those in the Mixconsole to avoid confusion and just use the audio fader?
When you touch it you have sent a volume change cc7 to Halion, whereas up till then no cc7 had been sent. Thereafter, to control the midi volume you have to send the corresponding cc7 message (with the fader or any other way.) Personally, I don't use midi volume too much, because for the VSTs I use the mod wheel or velocity is used.
charlesvk wrote:2. When the midi fader is turned up 100% the midi notes on the track are not hitting volume 127. There still is dynamic range. Why is that? What´s the use then: if I want things louder, I can turn the audio fader up?
I dunno, but see above...
charlesvk wrote:3. I forgot... Will post it when I remember.
:lol: :lol:
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charlesvk
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Re: Explanation Midi fader?

Post by charlesvk » Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:07 am

Thanks Steve!
Dell XPS Studio 8100 i7 860@2.80GHz, 16GB RAM, W7 Ultimate SP1 64-bit, Motu 828mk3, Cubase 8.0.5 64-bit

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GargoyleStudio
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Re: Explanation Midi fader?

Post by GargoyleStudio » Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:43 pm

The midi channel 'vu' meter shows the note velocity I think, so if you're velocities are low then the 'vu' meter is low.

One thing I use a lot instead of the midi fader (apart from automating the VSTi audio channel fader) is the velocity adjustment parameters, for example I set this to 20 for a given midi part or for the track in general and a velocity of 20 is added to all notes for the part or track. Of course, this doesn't always mean volume, but rather harder playing which is sometimes just what I need for banging out a harder edge during the chorus say on a piano.

Another thing on the midi fader values is that IIRC they go from 'off'->0->127. So, when you drag it down to off it goes through zero, sends CC07=0 and hence you get no volume. I think you can type 'off' into the value field and it jumps straight to off without sending a CC07 value to the instrument (or maybe it's off->1->128, can't remember now!).

Mike.
[Win10x64 latest, Cb10.5 latest, MOTU PCIe, UAD2, Waves, Soundtoys, O9N, Arturia, Omnisphere]

charlesvk
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Re: Explanation Midi fader?

Post by charlesvk » Wed Mar 27, 2013 3:11 pm

Thanks for your explanation Mike.
Dell XPS Studio 8100 i7 860@2.80GHz, 16GB RAM, W7 Ultimate SP1 64-bit, Motu 828mk3, Cubase 8.0.5 64-bit

peterandu
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Re: Explanation Midi fader?

Post by peterandu » Mon Dec 31, 2018 7:58 pm

I have the same question, if I touch the MIDI channel volume fader by accident, How to recover it to the default OFF position?

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GargoyleStudio
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Re: Explanation Midi fader?

Post by GargoyleStudio » Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:29 pm

peterandu wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 7:58 pm
I have the same question, if I touch the MIDI channel volume fader by accident, How to recover it to the default OFF position?
Pull the fader down until it says Off. You will find that the VST parameter it's controlling (usually Volume) is at 0. So, you need to then adjust that VST parameter back to it's default setting, probably full up, value 127.

Note that I suggested earlier in the thread that you could type 'Off' into the fader value but it doesn't work. Yes, you can type it in, but it replaces it with the value of 0 and sends the value 0 to the VST. Personally I've always thought it was a weird implementation :?

Mike.
[Win10x64 latest, Cb10.5 latest, MOTU PCIe, UAD2, Waves, Soundtoys, O9N, Arturia, Omnisphere]

peterandu
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Re: Explanation Midi fader?

Post by peterandu » Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:30 am

GargoyleStudio wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:29 pm
peterandu wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 7:58 pm
I have the same question, if I touch the MIDI channel volume fader by accident, How to recover it to the default OFF position?
Pull the fader down until it says Off. You will find that the VST parameter it's controlling (usually Volume) is at 0. So, you need to then adjust that VST parameter back to it's default setting, probably full up, value 127.

Note that I suggested earlier in the thread that you could type 'Off' into the fader value but it doesn't work. Yes, you can type it in, but it replaces it with the value of 0 and sends the value 0 to the VST. Personally I've always thought it was a weird implementation :?

Mike.
You can type "-1" to turn off it. I got this method from another thread. But the default position of OFF is not determined. It could be 127 by comparison using ear.

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GargoyleStudio
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Re: Explanation Midi fader?

Post by GargoyleStudio » Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:52 pm

Excellent, well spotted, I'll remember that one!!!

Mike.
[Win10x64 latest, Cb10.5 latest, MOTU PCIe, UAD2, Waves, Soundtoys, O9N, Arturia, Omnisphere]

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