Creating independent notehead sets

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UMahnken
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Creating independent notehead sets

Post by UMahnken »

I don't understand how to create new notehead sets without changing existing noteheads. An example:

- starting the notehead set editor
- creating a "New Notehead Set" with the button "New"
- in the notehead set I can see the default notehead, in my case "noteheadBlack"
- "Edit Notehead" and change the glyph to something different, for example a #
- the first notehead in the "Default Noteheads" headset shows the #, too

What the hell I am misunderstanding? Is there a tutorial how to deal with ceating new independent notehead sets? The little Youtube tutorial from Anthony doesn't cover this issue, I think.

benwiggy
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by benwiggy »

I'm a little uncertain about this as well, but I think you have to do the following:

1. Create a New Set
2. Add a New Notehead.
3. Remove the noteheadBlack notehead from the set.

You can't have an Empty Set, so it won't let you delete noteheadBlack until you've added something else. Any duplicates in your set of existing noteheads will change the original as well. You can't just change the names: if you change noteheadBlack to "MYnoteheadBlack", then the original notehead in the default set changes name as well!
Last edited by benwiggy on Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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pianoleo
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by pianoleo »

Furthermore you can’t delete a note head type that is currently in use in the project.
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UMahnken
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by UMahnken »

benwiggy wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:49 pm
2. Add a New Notehead.
But the "New Notehead" again is from the already available list of noteheads, so the problem is just moved to another notehead. A workaround could be to take a notehead which I will never use in the score. Curious ...

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by fkretlow »

You can either
  • assign (import) an existing notehead to the new set (at the bottom of the notehead set section, which is the upper half of the main dialog), or
  • create a new notehead (in the action bar at the bottom of the notehead section, which is the lower half of the dialog).
The latter is what you need to do.
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by UMahnken »

Thanks fkretlow, this is working :-)

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by benwiggy »

I agree that it's all a bit confusing. I've asked if John Barron could do one of his video talks about it.
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by falhousen »

Hmm.. Not sure if I'm still confused, but in 2.2 I tried to create an independent set of noteheads w/ parenthesis, thinking that I understand the process now; however, every time I open a new file (even via templates): the "Default Noteheads" set shows the edits I made to my "custom" set - see attached, and,

1) My custom set isn't saved for new projects (as in the attachment, my custom set isn't available in new projects).

2) Even though I hit the "Revert to Factory" button in the right-hand panel for each of the modified noteheads in the "Default Noteheads" set, this reversion to default isn't saved when I start a new file, and I'm again presented with the dialog as attached.

3) The "Revert to Factory" button in the left-hand panel is disabled for Default Noteheads, even though it shows that it's been modified.

4) Even though the Default Notehead Set shows my (unwanted) changes, the notes in the score look unmodified, i.e., no parens.

5) I can't tell where or if the actual notehead set in use is indicated for a given note?
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Daniel at Steinberg
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by Daniel at Steinberg »

You need to make sure you create a new notehead based on the default black notehead, rather than editing it directly: the button is in the lighter-coloured action bar at the bottom on the right-hand side of the dialog.

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by falhousen »

Thanks Daniel, I'm now doing it that way,but now things are "stuck" with a parenthesis around each of the 3 main default noteheads, and this comes up in every new project. Revert to Factory doesn't seem to be working. Any suggestions on how to get things back to normal?

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Daniel at Steinberg
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by Daniel at Steinberg »

Can you zip up and attach the file userlibrary.xml from %APPDATA%\Steinberg\Dorico 2 (Windows) or /Users/your-username/Library/Application Support/Steinberg/Dorico 2 (Mac)?

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by falhousen »

Hi Daniel, attached, thanks.
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Daniel at Steinberg
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by Daniel at Steinberg »

I've pruned the noteheads you'd saved as default from your userlibrary.xml file – make a backup of your file and try replacing it with the attached one (don't forget to unzip it first!).
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by falhousen »

Thanks Daniel, that worked "a treat" as the Brits say (I think...)

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by Daniel at Steinberg »

We do indeed. Glad to be able to help you.

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by JustusR »

I'm sorry to say I'm also totally confused about creating different noteheads (also noteheads with parentheses). Reading this thread just makes me more confused..... Is there any chance of a real step-by-step descriptions for dummies for this process?

If I create a new notehead (called "noteheads with parenthesis") and make edits in it (add parentheses), it also modifies the original default notehead set it was based on. There's lots of buttons that are not 100% clear what they do (add notehead to set is clear, but why is "remove notehead from set permanently greyed out), what is the difference between "delete" and "remove from set", and when/why are they greyed out. Daniel, I'm not sure which button you refer to above in your comment "You need to make sure you create a new notehead based on the default black notehead, rather than editing it directly: the button is in the lighter-coloured action bar at the bottom on the right-hand side of the dialog.", I have the feeling this might be key to my confusion.

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by Daniel at Steinberg »

As of Dorico 3, there's no distinction between in terms of colour beetween the two action bars in the Noteheead Sets dialog. The top action bar – the one in the 'Notehead Set' section, below the single-row grid of noteheads – is concerned with the notehead set, i.e. with which noteheads are included in the set, while the bottom action bar – the one in the 'Notehead' section – is concerned with the notehead that you have selected in the grid above.

The crucial thing is to create a new notehead by selecting the notehead you want your new notehead to be based on in the grid at the top of the dialog, then click the "New from Selection" button in the action bar at the bottom of the dialog, which creates a new notehead based on the selected one.

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by JustusR »

Thanks, Daniel, I will have another week at the weekend and get back to you.

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by JustusR »

Hi again,

OK, it took me a fair while longer, but I got it sorted. For the benefit of others who might have the same problem and stumble on this thread, this is what worked for me, step by step:

1) Go to Engrave -> Notehead sets
2) Bottom-Left of left-hand panel: Create new (notehead set...) from selection (named Default Noteheads (1);
2) Type new name for this set (top of top-right hand panel) e.g. "Noteheads between parentheses", which is now echoed in the left-hand panel;
3) Chose black note-head in the grid (in the top-rigth panel), click the Create new notehead from selection button (at the bottom of the right-bottom panel) [note: There are now TWO black noteheads in the grid. It is not obvious, but the Rightmost notehead is the NEW one, you want to edit. This is important....!];
4) Give the new (rightmost black) notehead a new name (I don't think this is important as such, but if the top left corner now shows a red triangle, you have selected the wrong notehead);
4) Double-click on the new notehead in the grid to open the editor. Edit as needed (i.e. in my case chose parentheses and click "add glyph", than move them to the right position) and click OK;
5) Now, select the old black notehead (without parentheses) by selecting it and click "remove notehead from the set" using the button at the bottom of the top-right panel. This is also important!;
6) Do the same for other noteheads (half/whole notes etc);
7) Click OK to save;
To check: 8) Now go back to Write mode, select a (black) notehead, and go Edit->Notehead->NOteheads between parentheses, and it should show the new notehead (incidentally, and this is a bit of a mistery: if you -re-select Default notehead, it becomes smaller.....)

(There may be other ways to skin this particular fish, but this worked for me).

Now, my understanding is that you can't export this notehead set, so you have to go through this again for any new file you're working on (or save a template).

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by MarcLarcher »

Save as default (or star button) should make this new notehead set available to any "new" project IIRC
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by JustusR »

Thanks Marc,

I can probably find this somewhere, but can you clarify: will that save it "as the default" of any future projects, or will it just make the newly defined noteheads available to future projects. I did see the button, and wondered about this, but I didn't have the guts to click it!

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by MarcLarcher »

I suppose it would make this notehead set available as well as all the others. This is how it works on the other areas of the program (playing techniques, tonalities, paragraph styles...)
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by pianoleo »

Marc’s correct. Just be aware that these parenthesised noteheads won’t work well when you have accidentals, or when they’re stacked as chords, or in chords with other noteheads. If implementing parenthesised noteheads was this simple, I have no doubt that the development team would have done it by now (as they’ve done for unpitched percussion).
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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by JustusR »

Understood!

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Re: Creating independent notehead sets

Post by SeeWhat »

parenthesised noteheads +10
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