VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

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BLOODMOON
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VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by BLOODMOON »

Hi. Congratulations on finally catching up with Melodyne.
It will be even better if you apply some improvements.

1. I would like the left / right movement of the note freely. If you want to move the note or adjust the beat, you have to pull the end of each note one by one to set it off.
2. Do not empty the vocal breath. The big problem is that VariAudio does not recognize words like breath sounds. Breath sounds should be freely editable.
3. A vertical grid of 8 bits or less is required. Please keep the key editor grid for detailed editing.
4. Tripple/dotted grid snap is not possible because of the above problem.
5. A visual volume change indication is required when adjusting the volume.
6. When adjusting the volume, it should be able to adjust the degree of smoothness of the dissolve between the notes. Melodyne allows you to adjust the smoothness of the volume and pitch between the notes, so you can naturally connects between notes, no matter how hard you Transform notes. (Please watch this video : https://youtu.be/wYxEpV4ADLs)

Thank you!
Last edited by BLOODMOON on Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:57 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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OxygenBeats
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by OxygenBeats »

And polyphonic support too.

Puma0382
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

BLOODMOON wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:54 am
Hi. Congratulations on finally catching up with Melodyne.
It will be even better if you apply some improvements.

1. I would like the left / right movement of the note freely. If you want to move the note or adjust the beat, you have to pull the end of each note one by one to set it off.
2. Do not empty the vocal breath. The big problem is that VariAudio does not recognize words like breath sounds. Breath sounds should be freely editable.
3. A vertical grid of 8 bits or less is required. Please keep the key editor grid for detailed editing.
4. Let me hear the note by clicking on the note.
5. A visual volume change indication is required when adjusting the volume.

6. When adjusting the volume, it should be able to adjust the degree of smoothness of the dissolve between the notes. Melodyne allows you to adjust the smoothness of the volume and pitch between the notes, so you can naturally connects between notes, no matter how hard you Transform notes. (Please watch this video : https://youtu.be/wYxEpV4ADLs)

Thank you!
I can hear the note when clicking on it; be sure you have the acoustic feedback button pressed in the Toolbar at top of the Editor window.
Also, your number 5 is a MUST have.! If they can adjust the background waveform image horizontally when warping segments (notes/words) to reflect the changes, surely it can't be too hard to show an increase/decrease in height of the waveform for amplitude changes.

Otherwise, nice list.!

bob
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

Also - please, please..!
Allow CTRL+ALT+mouse-drag, for free-zooming with the zoom tool (meaning vertical and horizontal movement depending on how you drag). See Melodyne's use if you need convincing - its killer-quick in helping navigation.! The current Zoom works horizontally ONLY with the zoom tool, and is really debilitating. We've got to have easier vertical zooming control.!
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

Last one for now... :)

Please add double-clicking in free space to start/stop playback; yes, I know I can now use SHIFT+ALT and click to place the playhead… but it is just such a killer move to have double-click to allow placement AND to start playback - at the same time.!! It makes for a wicked quick workflow. :D

Again, been spoilt with Melodyne of late... :mrgreen:

Thanks for listening.!
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

Puma0382
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

Ok, one more... ;) can you make the background waveform more 'visible' when using lighter colour schemes...? See attached...
VariAudio3_background waveform.jpg
Background waveform hard to see
(127.59 KiB) Not downloaded yet
A thin coloured outline to it might do the job. ;)


Thank you in advance.!
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

BLOODMOON
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by BLOODMOON »

Puma0382 wrote:
Sat Nov 17, 2018 6:55 pm
Ok, one more... ;) can you make the background waveform more 'visible' when using lighter colour schemes...? See attached...
VariAudio3_background waveform.jpg
A thin coloured outline to it might do the job. ;)


Thank you in advance.!
It looks better!
Thank you for nice adding.
Intel i7 6700 / 64GB RAM / Windows 10 / Cubase 10 Pro / Focusrite Forte
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BLOODMOON
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by BLOODMOON »

Image


VariAudio's voice recognition is especially serious on male vocals.
VariAudio should visualize all sounds including breath sounds.
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Jari Junttila
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Jari Junttila »

I think breath is pretty hard to define in harmonic content, and why would you want to tune breath and in scale, since it doesn´t have tone?
Format c:

BLOODMOON
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by BLOODMOON »

To adjust the volume and beat of the breath. In detail, since VariAudio treats the breath sounds completely differently, there is a problem that only the breath is excluded from adjusting the overall beat and volume with other notes. Of course you can see the disappearing area with Ctrl + drag, but it is not possible to edit the breath sounds into individual notes. Perhaps it is because I am too adapted to edit the breath with melodyne.
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Jari Junttila
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Jari Junttila »

Thanks for the clarification
Format c:

MERC476
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by MERC476 »

Puma0382 wrote:
Sat Nov 17, 2018 6:55 pm
Ok, one more... ;) can you make the background waveform more 'visible' when using lighter colour schemes...? See attached...
VariAudio3_background waveform.jpg
A thin coloured outline to it might do the job. ;)


Thank you in advance.!
I've tried everything to change my Variaudio 3 background back to a lighter color like 9.5 but cannot find which setting in the color preferences changes this. Where can I change it to look like yours? Thanks!

MERC476
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by MERC476 »

Am I the only one that keeps clicking this dang glue icon whenever I go to move a segment?

BLOODMOON
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by BLOODMOON »

Image

The range of the glue tool is unnecessarily wide. Allow short notes to be cut, not glue.
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Puma0382
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

MERC476 wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:51 pm
Puma0382 wrote:
Sat Nov 17, 2018 6:55 pm
Ok, one more... ;) can you make the background waveform more 'visible' when using lighter colour schemes...? See attached...
VariAudio3_background waveform.jpg
A thin coloured outline to it might do the job. ;)


Thank you in advance.!
I've tried everything to change my Variaudio 3 background back to a lighter color like 9.5 but cannot find which setting in the color preferences changes this. Where can I change it to look like yours? Thanks!
Hello @MERC476 - sorry for delay in replying...

Not at my machine, but if I recall correctly, I adjusted the 'Editor Background' category under Custom Colours to give me that light hue. Wasn't tricky or difficult as I remember... Good luck.!
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

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Puma0382
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

Shameless bump of all these suggestions/requests. A gentle reminder:-

1. Zoom improvements. The Zoom Tool needs to have vertical zoom functionality, as well as horizontal - 'free zooming' as you mouse-drag. Would really, really help navigation and general 'inside-the-window' workflow.
2. Visual indication of background waveform when making a volume (amplitude) change - you allow showing time-warping of the waveform; we need to see amplitude change too.! Please.
3. Better distinction of the background waveform - thin outline or contrast improvement, whatever...
4. Double-click in empty space to re-position the playhead and start playback - check Melodyne behaviour. Its ace and super fast for the workflow.

Can the 'Pitch Snap mode' default, be set globally.?

Future, future request - what about displaying an entirely separate reference audio track (of our choosing) in a new window along the top/inside the main VA window..? I often don't have any MIDI stuff in my projects (live sound/whole show multitrack audio). And besides, VA is not just for vocals... ;)
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

jaypohlman
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by jaypohlman »

All great suggestions! Just chiming in.

AtariST
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by AtariST »

Puma0382 wrote:
Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:47 am
....A gentle reminder:-

1. Zoom improvements. The Zoom Tool needs to have vertical zoom functionality, as well as horizontal - 'free zooming' as you mouse-drag. Would really, really help navigation and general 'inside-the-window' workflow.
2. Visual indication of background waveform when making a volume (amplitude) change - you allow showing time-warping of the waveform; we need to see amplitude change too.! Please.
3. Better distinction of the background waveform - thin outline or contrast improvement, whatever...
4. Double-click in empty space to re-position the playhead and start playback - check Melodyne behaviour. Its ace and super fast for the workflow.

...
in addition to all the very useful enhancements suggested here in this thread, I'd wish so see the following:

let me please create a preset for VariAudio 3 settings, so I do not have to make the same choices over and over again, like: zoom (a fixed zoom level, no matter how long the audio is), color mode, pitch snap mode, algorithm, smart controls, ....

And please visualize the movement of the formant (like Melodyne) and show a little indicator (in dB), when a "blop" is changed in volume (only there, were is was changed), for future reference....

And finally: Would't it be nice, if VariAudio 3 suggests the best algorithm for the audio itself (optional)

Thanks!

Puma0382
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

Another few:-

5. Suspend Auto-Scroll when Editing - should include when a segment is selected/highlighted.

So, you're reviewing/auditioning a small section you're working on; a segment of interest is highlighted. Currently the viewport will scroll away, as the playhead nears the right-hand side of the Sample Editor window. Not nice. If I'm just checking (trial and error) my adjustments, I want the highlighted segment to stay in view (until I click in some blank area to release its status/focus).

Please look at Melodyne's workflow to see how useful/friendly/helpful this can be.!

6. Using a Rubber-band doesn't scroll viewport (vertically) - click-dragging the mouse 'out of bounds' top or bottom of the Sample Editor window, won't scroll the display. (Beyond left or right edges of the window, the display scrolls as expected).

Lots of people on large size/hi-DPI resolution screens probably won't ever see this as an issue. But I'm on a 22" LCD at 1920x1080 and even with the Sample Editor in its own separate large-ish window, its a problem; laptop users will suffer most. Besides, this should just work.

7. Display full 'Current Pitch' info label in the segments - as zoom allows, only the note/pitch label (E2, F#2, etc.,) will be displayed inside a selected segment. There's room to include the +/- % (percentage) value, as shown in the Info Line readout.

Would save all the 'eyeball tennis' you play, bouncing up and down to the Info Line and to where you are actually working… ;)

8. Include a new slider to adjust background dynamic waveform contrast - a simple slider control would do, placed at the bottom of the window, next to horizontal zoom (see Request Idea 3 above). Would aid 'visibility' depending on personal choice of Editor Background colour.

9. This one from @BLOODMOON is super important... Please don't forget.! :-
BLOODMOON wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:54 am
6. When adjusting the volume, it should be able to adjust the degree of smoothness of the dissolve between the notes. Melodyne allows you to adjust the smoothness of the volume and pitch between the notes, so you can naturally connects between notes, no matter how hard you Transform notes. (Please watch this video : https://youtu.be/wYxEpV4ADLs)
That's it for now... ;)
[Edited 27 Apr 2019]
Last edited by Puma0382 on Mon May 27, 2019 5:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

Puma0382
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

After working (VA) quite a bit this weekend, if there's only time/resource for ONE more big improvement (maybe at v10.5 ..?), please let it be this this one...
BLOODMOON wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:54 am
6. When adjusting the volume, it should be able to adjust the degree of smoothness of the dissolve between the notes. Melodyne allows you to adjust the smoothness of the volume and pitch between the notes, so you can naturally connects between notes, no matter how hard you Transform notes. (Please watch this video : https://youtu.be/wYxEpV4ADLs)

Its really lacking in the results (compared to how Melodyne copes).
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

Puma0382
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

Puma0382 wrote:
Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:23 am
Another few:-

5. Suspend Auto-Scroll when Editing - should include when a segment is selected/highlighted.

So, you're reviewing/auditioning a small section you're working on; a segment of interest is highlighted. Currently the viewport will scroll away, as the playhead nears the right-hand side of the Sample Editor window. Not nice. If I'm just checking (trial and error) my adjustments, I want the highlighted segment to stay in view (until I click in some blank area to release its status/focus).

Please look at Melodyne's workflow to see how useful/friendly/helpful this can be.!

6. Using a Rubber-band doesn't scroll viewport (vertically) - click-dragging the mouse 'out of bounds' top or bottom of the Sample Editor window, won't scroll the display. (Beyond left or right edges of the window, the display scrolls as expected).

Lots of people on large size/hi-DPI resolution screens probably won't ever see this as an issue. But I'm on a 22" LCD at 1920x1080 and even with the Sample Editor in its own separate large-ish window, its a problem; laptop users will suffer most. Besides, this should just work.

7. Display full 'Current Pitch' info label in the segments - as zoom allows, only the note/pitch label (E2, F#2, etc.,) will be displayed inside a selected segment. There's room to include the +/- % (percentage) value, as shown in the Info Line readout.

Would save all the 'eyeball tennis' you play, bouncing up and down to the Info Line and to where you are actually working… ;)

8. Include a new slider to adjust background dynamic waveform contrast - a simple slider control would do, placed at the bottom of the window, next to horizontal zoom (see Request Idea 3 above). Would aid 'visibility' depending on personal choice of Editor Background colour.

9. This one from @BLOODMOON is super important... Please don't forget.! :-
BLOODMOON wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:54 am
6. When adjusting the volume, it should be able to adjust the degree of smoothness of the dissolve between the notes. Melodyne allows you to adjust the smoothness of the volume and pitch between the notes, so you can naturally connects between notes, no matter how hard you Transform notes. (Please watch this video : https://youtu.be/wYxEpV4ADLs)
That's it for now... ;)
[Edited 27 Apr 2019]
Its almost like I set myself a reminder a year ago; (weird.! :mrgreen: :ugeek: :? :lol: )

Still a good list, but particularly item 9; hit it again this morning and why I'm here... An ability is needed, to smooth adjoining volume (gain) levels of segments, each side of an adjustment made on one segment.
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

lovegames
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by lovegames »

Having used Melodyne a lot, I'm fairly fine with how VariAudio works and don't mind opening up Melodyne now and then. I'd rather see Steinberg pay attention to other things... You can only ask for so much ya know. I think ARA2 eliminates the need for VariAudio to receive as much focus and attention as this thread is requesting because Melodyne and other tuning software can be used as part of the program now.

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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

lovegames wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 3:19 pm
Having used Melodyne a lot, I'm fairly fine with how VariAudio works and don't mind opening up Melodyne now and then. I'd rather see Steinberg pay attention to other things... You can only ask for so much ya know. I think ARA2 eliminates the need for VariAudio to receive as much focus and attention as this thread is requesting because Melodyne and other tuning software can be used as part of the program now.
If you have Melodyne, maybe... If you're willing to spend (at least for comparable feature-set) another 400 Euro, if you don't. Maybe...

Its great that you're covered. Good for you.

Regardless of ARA2, all the points made in this thread continue to be valid requests for improvements to VA3.

I'm realistic in that it probably won't get another proper look at for another year or maybe more; but at least we have things documented here... Yes, there's seemingly always things more important than our own personal area of interest... I get that.

(PS:- a much bigger topic - tempo mapping support with ARA2 anyone..?)
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by jguy555 »

MERC476 wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:55 pm
Am I the only one that keeps clicking this dang glue icon whenever I go to move a segment?
You are not

Puma0382
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Re: VariAudio 3 Improvement Request

Post by Puma0382 »

MERC476 wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:55 pm
Am I the only one that keeps clicking this dang glue icon whenever I go to move a segment?
Ha.! Well, with @jguy555 that's three of us... and there have been others... ;)

But, that's how it used to be... :)

I found the answer is to work with slightly 'bigger' segments; increase the height of them (vertical zoom) and you won't suffer this 'glue tool' happening so much... Downside, you might need to do more navigation moves inside the window to see what you want to actually work on...

But hey, got used to it now; working happily and rarely hitting that accidental glue tool thing any more.

PS:- did I mention, rubber-banding a selection (click+drag an area) would be great if it worked to scroll the window contents vertically, when you go beyond top or bottom limits of the viewport. Doing the same horizontally, the data scrolls in the window as you would expect, left/right. Annoying.
System 1:- Win10 64bit, Gigabyte H81M m/board, Intel i7 4790 3.6Ghz, 16Gb RAM, NVIDIA GTX 750 Ti, 2 x 22" HD monitors; Steinberg UR44; Cubase Pro v10.5.20, WaveLab Pro v10.0.40, Studio One v4.6.1, Dorico Elements v3.5.10, Addictive Drums 2, Komplete 12, StylusRMX

System 2:- Win10 32bit, Q6600 2.4 Ghz, 4Gb RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 8400 GS, Delta 1010LT; Cubase Pro v8.0.40, WaveLab Pro v9.1.0, Komplete10, StylusRMX

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