mod wheel mapping for dummies

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Robert_G
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mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:01 am

like me.

I've read the manuals...I've searched the forums...the internet..it must be going over my head. I have Cubase 10 elements. I use Play 6 and NI Kontact. VSTs

The 2 mod wheel type things on my Roland FP60 will Midi learn whatever I need it to, but it won't UNLEARN CC7 ( Main Volume)
Both Mod wheels insist on keeping CC7. The main volume in my Kontakt Libarary in the upper right always moves with my physical Mod wheel. I don't want it to. I just want to use it for CC1 and CC11 and be done with it. How do I change where my physical mod wheels are mapped to?


What am I doing wrong?


Thanks in advance.

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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Martin.Jirsak » Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:22 pm

Hi,

Please, double-check Studio > Studio Setup > all Remote Devices.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Tue Jan 22, 2019 4:17 am

Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:22 pm
Hi,

Please, double-check Studio > Studio Setup > all Remote Devices.

Done that.
Nothing called 'all remote devices'. Remote Devices gives me a blank page. Generic Remote gives me a list of Fader control names.
Like I said....I'm missing something....or its going over my head. I'm pretty new at Cubase, but I do know that cc1 and cc11 are something I need to learn how to map.

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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by peakae » Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:18 am

Like Martin I’m suspecting something is not set up the right way.
Check all your midi settings, make you are not sending midi information to other devices or ports that might be looping around.
That includes the “All Midi In” settings, make sure only the appropriate midi devices are selected.
It might be easier to spot if you take a few screenshots.
Could also be something completely different, but let’s rule out the easiest causes first.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Wed Jan 23, 2019 4:24 am

peakae wrote:
Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:18 am
Like Martin I’m suspecting something is not set up the right way.
Check all your midi settings, make you are not sending midi information to other devices or ports that might be looping around.
That includes the “All Midi In” settings, make sure only the appropriate midi devices are selected.
It might be easier to spot if you take a few screenshots.
Could also be something completely different, but let’s rule out the easiest causes first.
Ok....here are some snapshots...if there are specific ones you want....let me know.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Wed Jan 23, 2019 4:27 am

a couple more.....
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Wed Jan 23, 2019 4:53 am

I just found something else out.
My left mod wheel also controls stereo in....which I do not want.
And my right mod wheel controls stereo out....which I do not want.

Hopefully this can be all fixed.

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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Martin.Jirsak » Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:28 am

Hi,

Set the Generic Remote MIDI Input to Not Connected. This should solve your problem.

If you use any Quick Controls, unassigned them, or set the Quick Controls (both Track and VST) MIDI Input to Not Connected too.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Thu Jan 24, 2019 1:48 am

Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:28 am
Hi,

Set the Generic Remote MIDI Input to Not Connected. This should solve your problem.

If you use any Quick Controls, unassigned them, or set the Quick Controls (both Track and VST) MIDI Input to Not Connected too.
Thank you for fixing the stereo out and stereo in. I did what you said and it worked, but the mod wheels both still control the main volume in Cubase, Kontakt, and Play.

Here is a screen shot of my Kontakt player. You can see the red square beside CC7. It lights up when I'm moving either mod wheels...and they aren't even assigned to anything. And it still moves the volume control in the upper right hand area.

More information. I did a right click Midi learn on the Swell, or Dynamics......and it automatically assigned it to CC 7.I want it to assign to midi 1 where it should be...because now the mod wheel activates both the Dynamics and the main volume.....No good..

And as you can see from the flute snapshot....It assigns everything to cc7....and for some reason....it doesn't even 'say' main volume there....just the additional ones that I assigned.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:25 am

Do any settings need to be changed here?
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Martin.Jirsak » Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:57 am

Hi,

Are you sure, there is no Quick Controls Assignment? Dodo you set also the Track/VST Quick Controls MIDI In to Not Connected?

Are you sure the Mod wheel sends MIDI CC1? Could you Insert MIDI Monitor and check what MIDI Messages is received by Cubase?
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Fri Jan 25, 2019 2:23 am

Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:57 am
Hi,

Are you sure, there is no Quick Controls Assignment? Dodo you set also the Track/VST Quick Controls MIDI In to Not Connected?

Are you sure the Mod wheel sends MIDI CC1? Could you Insert MIDI Monitor and check what MIDI Messages is received by Cubase?
Quick Controls Assignment and Track/Vst Quick Controls Midi are the same as they were in Snapshot 3 and 4 except the Roland is longer an input. Both input and output are 'not connected'

The mod wheel does NOT send midi CC1 by default. That's the problem. Both mod wheels send Midi CC 7 by default and I can't seem to change that. I can only get moduation or expression if the instrument happens to have the correct knob for it (midi learn), but it registers as CC 7 as I showed in the Kontakt snapshot. And on top of that, because its default midi cc7, if I assign 'midi learn' to a 'dynamic' knob, the mod wheel controls both dynamics and main volume which is a disaster.


I don't know how to insert midi monitor.

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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Martin.Jirsak » Fri Jan 25, 2019 8:57 am

Hi,

Please read the Roland manual or ask in the forum, how to change the mod wheel assignment. It's nonsense that 2 mod wheels send the same value.

To add MIDI Monitor: Open the MIDI Inserts in Cubase's Undirected, click to the empty slot and select the MIDI Monitor from the list.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by BJ » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:36 am

According to Roland website, FP60 does not have any mod wheels.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Martin.Jirsak » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:44 am

Hi,

I had a look to the Piano and quickly to the manual. I guess Robert_G is moving the two Part (Lower and Upper) sliders. According to manual, these "Adjusts the volume of..." lower/upper part divided by the Split point. So it makes sense, they send MIDI CC7 (Volume).

As I know some instruments system, I would guess, that Roland FP 60 is using 2 MIDI Channels, once you split the keyboard. So I guess, that the left slider (Part Lower) sends MIDI CC7 on MIDI Channel 1, and the right slider (Part Upper) sends MIDI CC7 on MIDI Channel 2. This would explain, why does it controls Volume.

This instrument is not meant to be for the use case to be used as a master keyboard and send advanced MIDI messages. So it's not possible to change the MIDI data, which are sent out.

But, if you have Cubase Pro, you can use MIDI Input Transformer to transform incoming MIDI data.

So one of the Input Transformer could look like:

Code: Select all

Type Is > Equal > Controller > And
Value 1 (MIDI Controller Number) > Equal > CC7 (Main Volume) > And
Channel (MIDI Controller Channel Equal) > 1
---
Action
Value 1 > Set fixed Value > CC1 (Modulation).
By this you would change, that the 1st slider would be translated to the Modulation.

and the 2nd Input Transformer could look like:

Code: Select all

Type Is > Equal > Controller > And
Value 1 (MIDI Controller Number) > Equal > CC7 (Main Volume) > And
Channel (MIDI Controller Channel Equal) > 2
---
Action
Value 1 > Set fixed Value > CC11 (Expression).
By this you would change, that the 1st slider would be translated to the Expression.

Then you can map it freely in your instrument.

I hope this will work for you.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Sat Jan 26, 2019 3:42 am

Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:44 am
Hi,

I had a look to the Piano and quickly to the manual. I guess Robert_G is moving the two Part (Lower and Upper) sliders. According to manual, these "Adjusts the volume of..." lower/upper part divided by the Split point. So it makes sense, they send MIDI CC7 (Volume).
Correct. Those are the 2 sliders I'm talking about.
Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:44 am
This instrument is not meant to be for the use case to be used as a master keyboard and send advanced MIDI messages. So it's not possible to change the MIDI data, which are sent out.

That is what I was afraid of. The Roland FP-60 is a beautiful digital piano and piano is what I do best, so that's why I got it. At the time, I bought it, I barely knew what a midi controller was much less how to work one. I don't regret buying it...but I'm going to need to purchase a proper midi controller.
Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:44 am
But, if you have Cubase Pro, you can use MIDI Input Transformer to transform incoming MIDI data.
I have elements. I'm only 3 months into using Cubase....and I do like it, but not ready to go pro yet. This suggestion of yours is the first reason I'd consider upgrading, but as someone else pointed out....the sliders on the Roland aren't great mod wheels anyways.....

I have one last question....I'm considering buying the Komplete Kontrol A49 just for the modewheels mostly. Is there such thing as a cheaper Midi Controller that just has a couple of really nice mod wheels (no keyboard needed) that would be easy to assign??? Would love some suggestions.....or should I just go with the Komplete Kontrol A49?
https://www.native-instruments.com/en/p ... 5-a49-a61/

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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Martin.Jirsak » Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:01 pm

Hi,

What about Novation Launch Control XL, for example? Or some alternatives of it?
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Tue Jan 29, 2019 2:52 am

Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:01 pm
Hi,

What about Novation Launch Control XL, for example? Or some alternatives of it?
That's an interesting little machine. Are all 8 faders easily assignable for midi?
My only concern is how much it is hyped for Ableton. Wonder how it would be for Cubase?

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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Martin.Jirsak » Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:48 am

Hi,

It's a generic MIDI controller. So no problem with Cubase at all. I don't own it, but in the past I had a Novation keyboard and it was fully programmable.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:00 am

Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:48 am
Hi,

It's a generic MIDI controller. So no problem with Cubase at all. I don't own it, but in the past I had a Novation keyboard and it was fully programmable.

I was looking at their midi controller 'Launchkey MK2 49-Key Controller' ....My biggest question would be whether the pitch bend wheel is easily remapped to CC11 (expression). That is the most comfortable place to control expression while playing keys with the right hand.

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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Martin.Jirsak » Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:35 am

Hi,

It's not common to be able to change the PitchBend wheel to send other MIDI message. But I can't say if this device can it can't do so. Again, you could solve this in Cubase Pro by using Input Transformer.

Are you really sure you would like to use the PitchBend wheel? This one is very specific, because it always returns back to the center when you release it.
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Re: mod wheel mapping for dummies

Post by Robert_G » Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:02 pm

Martin.Jirsak wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:35 am
Hi,

It's not common to be able to change the PitchBend wheel to send other MIDI message. But I can't say if this device can it can't do so. Again, you could solve this in Cubase Pro by using Input Transformer.

Are you really sure you would like to use the PitchBend wheel? This one is very specific, because it always returns back to the center when you release it.
True. I forgot it returns to the center.

Upgrade to Cubase pro will have to wait if I want to buy a new midi controller :D

I'm surprised how hard it is to find a midi controller with a nice designated CC11 wheel. Expression is so important. It doesn't make sense....but if one of the faders can be assigned....I guess that's better than nothing. Also none of these midi controllers at this price range which i also considered have an input for an expression pedal which is unfortunate too.

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