Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

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ejocvx
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Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by ejocvx »

Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, please do not include the bar in multi-rests - even if the bar is empty.
it will show up only "one bar" with a repeating sign, no indication at all how many there really are.
So the annoyed drummer is missing bars in his part.

To you guys this would be perhaps a feature request but for me it is a real issue.

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TheMaestro
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by TheMaestro »

Sorry I don't understand.

The problem is precisely the opposite!:

The repeat bar sign does not show up in mutli-rests when the last bar before the repeat sign is empty.
This is the issue (while there is a workaround).

Why should the repeat bar not show up in multi-rests layout?!
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ejocvx
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by ejocvx »

Wow easy. Thinking we're talking about the same thing here? Say you're transcribing a drum part from an recorded audio. I usually populate just one measure with midi notes and and the following bars that are supposed to sound the same, will get a "show bar repeat sign" although they do not contain any midi notes.
So in the score editor edit mode it looks like this:
Editmode.png
(46.79 KiB) Not downloaded yet
And I would want to have it look it exactly like this, while still having multi rests set to on. (in case the drums has to tacet 102 bars for example)
When switching to page mode it shows like this (as you've probably have mentioned)
pagemode.png
(101.08 KiB) Not downloaded yet
So no indication indeed how many bars are lost. And production time lost + confusion on stage.
I know there are Cubase workarounds for this, Cubase workarounds for that. But we do not want Cubase to be a collection of workarounds do we? I know how to fix this in a score part don't worry. All I want is the program to behave logically. Because Logically there is data in those bars (the repeat sign) so logically they're not empty and should not be part of a multi rest at all.
Thnx for your replay anyways
regards,
Hans

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TheMaestro
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by TheMaestro »

Ok now I see: I was talking about "Repeat Bars (barlines)", while you were actually talking about "bar repeats" ;)
Ok maybe we are playing with words.

ejocvx wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 8:30 pm
I know how to fix this in a score part don't worry.
So please tell me how you fix this.

Because the answer is in what you've written:
ejocvx wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 8:30 pm
Because Logically there is data in those bars (the repeat sign) so logically they're not empty and should not be part of a multi rest at all.

I agree, but unfortunately the bar repeat sign in the score editor is just a graphic symbol.
Which means the bar containing the bar repeat sign is (or considered as) actually really empty, at least MIDI speaking!

You see where I'm going here.
As the score editor is highly MIDI data oriented (as opposed to only graphic), it needs to some extent that all MIDI data to be present.
So what you have to do (probably this was your "fix") is to actually duplicate the notes from the previous bar and then apply the bar repeat sign (and vice versa).

This is not a "workaround" in my opinion. This is how the score editor is designed: a "musicians view of MIDI data" as the developer himself describes his program.

That said, I think It would be a valid feature request: the bar repeat could be an active function. It could duplicate the notes from the previous bar. And in addition, in case you have 102 bars (;) ) it could have a number indicating the number of repeated bars, as for multi-rests.
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ejocvx
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by ejocvx »

Hi Maestro, thanks again for replying,
Since lessons learned the hard way - I'm now putting at least one single piece of midi data (bogus note or something like that) in every bar that is meant to show the repeat bar sign. To me that sounds pretty much as again a workaround. Offcourse I could do also do a drag and duplicate bars in future, and then assign them to show the repeat sign, but this too feels a bit cumbersome to me.

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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by ejocvx »

Oh, and another solution (well-workaround) would be off course to split the multi rests one by one manually.

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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by ejocvx »

unfortunately the bar repeat sign in the score editor is just a graphic symbol.
That's were the "mucisians view on midi" goes wrong. The bar repeat sign indicates that there's something sounding. Please find some free bogus midi data bytes (sys exclusive? free controllerdate?, or even a midi "keyswitch like" note with velocity on 00 and velocity off FF?) to insert into the bar when it shows the sign.

And by the way a midi-note-less bar with "show rhythmic notation" slashes should be treated the same as a bar showing the bar repeat sign.

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Michael Michaelis
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by Michael Michaelis »

I *think* I understand your request: if "rhythm notation" is activated for a specific bar / range, it should be excluded from the "multi rest"-"treatment". Is that what you're asking for?
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ejocvx
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by ejocvx »

Yep, and that goes for bars showing the repeat bar signs also. Exclude them from the "multi rest"-"treatment", act as if those bars have midi data in them even when they actually don't

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TheMaestro
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by TheMaestro »

@Michael
I think what he is requesting is not specifically related to rhythmic notation.

Please see the "board" attached.

Nothing is wrong with multi-rests function. It works logically: it treats "rests", not "repeats"!
What we need here is a new feature: "Multi-Repeat" treatment ;)
It would be useful mostly for drummers.

@ejocvx
In the meantime, what troubles me is why you refuse to copy real notes into those bars (measures) and insist on inserting bogus and dummy notes.
Just put the actual notes!

What I understand is you don't need correct playback.


By the way what I was pointing out in my first post was another issue with "Repeat bars": there, yes, you would really need to use bogus notes as a workaround. ;)
Improvement needed.
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ejocvx
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by ejocvx »

Hmm I'm just a typical user here, but personally I do not like the "number of bars" (in your example "5") and just display that number over just "one" bar with repeat sign. I would prefer to just display them all like in the "edit" mode. Like so:

example:
♫♫♫♫ | '/. | '/. | '/. |
This visually stays as a 4 bars playing music (and not one bar + 3)
And it is still possible to add dynamics like crescendo etc.
The repeat bar means that you have to play what has been played in the previous bar.

I could also write something like this in rhythmic notation (ascii notes also in Rhythmic ) :
♫♫♫♫ | //// | //// | //// |
Also this visually looks as a 4 bars playing music.
the //// notation meaning "play something like I showed you in bar one"

When writing some big band jazzy stuff with the rhythmic notation you'd normally only squeeze in the "accents" to get the rhythm section to play what is wanted: (I hope my ascii art will allow me to do that...)

medium jazz:
//// | //// | //// | //♪♪/ |
So this looks like 4 bars of playing "medium jazz" with something special happening in bar 4.
For a jazz double bass or piano I could actually use the same part but show the chord track with it. (and use a bass clef or treble clef, well - the piano would require more info probably)

Another thing: How do you write that example bar 4 with the accents in Cubase score editor? Well that's worth a subject on its own:
- put in the accents in regular notation, switch and the bar to Rhythmic Notation
- Manually hide all not needed rests. (there could be some rest symbols needed for clarification)
- Fill those empty places up with a graphical "/" symbol.
- format top align the inserted "/" symbols.

To me the bottom line is that there's always difference between displaying multi-rests and displaying "make sound"
Last edited by ejocvx on Mon Mar 02, 2020 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ejocvx
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Re: Score editor: whenever "repeat bar" sign is showing, do not include the bar in multi-rests

Post by ejocvx »

example1.jpg
some example 1
(194.47 KiB) Not downloaded yet
example3.jpg
some example 3
(133.27 KiB) Not downloaded yet
example4.jpg
some example 4
(279.48 KiB) Not downloaded yet

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