[issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

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FishCorp
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[issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by FishCorp » Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:38 pm

Hello!

I've discovered a rather annoying bug when cutting up transposed audio using the elastique (pro) time algorithm (using C6.5).

Repro:

- New Project
- Import or record some audio. A 440hz sine will expose the issue very obviously.
- Make sure the audio-file algorithm is set to an Elastique Time algorithm in the audio pool.
- Transpose the clip 12 semitones (or any other amount)
* Notice smooth playback!
- Split the clip using the scissor tool into a few segments.
* Notice "pitchbend" glitch on split-points of the clip.

This is really annoying when doing leveling of individual sections on a transposed piece of audio. I could of course flatten or print the transposed audio, but i like to work as non-destructive as possible, so i would appreciate this bug fixed.

Best,
Rune Borup / FishCorp
Copenhagen, DK
Last edited by FishCorp on Thu Jul 05, 2012 6:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Guest

Re: [BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed with elastique time

Post by Guest » Mon Jun 25, 2012 3:27 pm

your right ive reproduced your elastique behavior , the transpose seems to be delayed at each start and starts with the original value.
The only cure is to glue the slices back together after editing !

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Re: [BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed with elastique time

Post by Vinylizor » Mon Jun 25, 2012 6:53 pm

This has been a problem ever since elastique was added to Cubase - I submitted this issue along with problems with disk access on time stretched audio as a bug. They fixed the access one but this one hasn't been acknowledged.

Switching the algo will fix it (at the cost of possibly making the audio worse) or alternatively do as filterfreak suggested and bounce down an extended bit of audio and trim back the start point.
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Re: [BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed with elastique time

Post by Breame » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:56 pm

I constantly have this issue and it drives me mad!

I can confirm that this appears to affect Elasique Tape most of all - ie. it's the most obvious. Even when flattening the file, the effect can be heard. Yuck.

Steinberg, please acknowledge this issue at least?
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Re: [BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed with elastique time

Post by FishCorp » Thu Jul 05, 2012 6:12 pm

BUMP!

I cannot accept that a bug with such an obvious repro goes unrecognized by Steinberg!

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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Cantankerous » Sun Jul 08, 2012 12:43 pm

+1
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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by vic_france » Sun Jul 08, 2012 1:06 pm

Do you still experience the problem if you set the clip to élastique Pro - Pitch?
[EDIT: yes, it is still there, but no where near as bad].
Filterfreak's workaround is the way to go ;).
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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by JHP » Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:09 am

Hi, :)
I couldn't reproduce. Here a clip that is divided into segments sounds the same as a clip that is not cut into segments.

This will do:
-----------
- New Project
- Import or record some audio. A 440hz sine will expose the issue very obviously.
- Make sure the audio-file algorithm is set to an Elastique Time algorithm in the audio pool.
- Transpose the clip 12 semitones (or any other amount)
* Notice smooth playback!
Duplicated the track and reveresed the phase
- Split one of the clips using the scissor tool into a few segments.
* Notice "pitchbend" glitch on split-points of the clip.

Still the two clips cancel each other out.


Now uncheck and then check musical mode again.
The two clips do not cancel eachother out anymore.
-----------
I cannot confirm this as a bug. Be aware that elastique is a realtime process. This could also be a more or less unavoidable artifact when applying this real-time effect to the segments. However I will report this as a story and it will be investigated by the respective specialists.

Thank you :)
Gr,
JHP
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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by vic_france » Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:53 am

JHP wrote: - Transpose the clip 12 semitones (or any other amount)
* Notice smooth playback!
Sorry, Jan, but no! Here, I can distinctly hear the test tone "hoop up" the octave at the start of playback..
Test Tone A440_transp.wav.zip
(775.22 KiB) Downloaded 100 times
This audio is the bounce of the Cubase test tone, at A440, transposed up one octave (no split), using élastique Pro - Time. Just listen to the start of it!
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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by JHP » Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:48 pm

Hi,
It is also a difference if you position the cursor to the beginning of the clip and then hit space to play or if you position the curser to the beginning of the clip during play mode for instance by hitting Num 1 to jump the cursor back to the clip during play mode. You can also test this by duplicating your testone and then positioning the curser at the beginning of the first clip. When you then press play and you let the cursor run over both clips, the start of the first clip will sound different then the start of the second clip.

Anyway you’re absolutely right. This artifact is in the mixdown you have attached.
I have pasted the link to this thread in the report. Any further observations and aspects are welcome.

Thank you, :)
Greetings,
JHP
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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by vic_france » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:03 pm

Hi Jan,
I suspect there's something else at play here (buffer size? settings in Device Setup>VST Audio System?)
I have just tried all the alternative start methods you suggested, and it "hoops" every time.. including the start of the duplicated clip.
However, if I simply split the file, it plays across the split without problem.
It is also o.k. if I start playback after the start of the clip.

So the topic's starter's header does sum it up perfectly.. "Glitch on clip start" ;)
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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Livewire » Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:14 pm

Hi,

Yes, this same bug is driving me crazy. I love the new algo's and it's a real shame that this bug just makes it really difficult to get exact results. I hope that SB sort it out on the next release.

Thanks

Erin

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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Weasel » Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:22 pm

I just thought I'd mention this bug is at play whether or not any transposition is involved or not. It will "hoop" at the top of the clip using time stretching only. It just ruins a perfectly good tool. This really needs to be prioritized for C7.
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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Guest » Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:31 pm

Has this been addressed in C7?

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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Livewire » Thu Jan 24, 2013 12:56 am

I would like to know if this has been addressed in C7 too...

????

It's driving me mad on a project at the moment.

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Re: [CONFIRMED BUG] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Guest » Thu Jan 24, 2013 9:13 pm

Livewire wrote:I would like to know if this has been addressed in C7 too...
To be honost, I think this should be fixed in 6.5.5 too. This is a reproducable and confirmed flaw in the program, reported 7 months ago.

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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Crotchety » Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:29 pm

The same pitchbend "hoop" seems to be happening when looping back to the Left Locator. This is on a pitch-shifted single event of an entire file of several minutes looping around a short section in the middle.

If I start at or before the Left Locator it doesn't happen, just when it loops back.

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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Guest » Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:36 pm

Just trying to pitch shift some brass samples to make musical phrases... it is now impossible using elastique, which causes a pitch bend at the start of every single segment; the "solo" algorithms all sound like complete and utter sh1te on this sound source, they are all warbly and grainy. There are too many bits of audio to use the workaround of bouncing extra silence on the front.

Bottom line: This tool is completely ruined :(

Please please please sort this out for 6.55 !

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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by NYC Composer » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:34 am

Does this problem exist on 6.0 versions of Cubase as well?
Regards, L.J.

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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Guest » Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:11 pm

When will this be fixed?

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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Guest » Sat Mar 09, 2013 11:23 pm

You guys broke my elastique and I would like you to fix it.

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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by hotpinkbirds » Sun Mar 10, 2013 2:45 pm

I would also like to add to the chorus related to this bug..

This makes me crazy and is a huge workflow killer.

Steinberg please address.

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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Livewire » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:39 am

Well, here I am again as this bug drives me mad. I just installed the trial version of C7 and it's exactly the same problem as on C6.

All the new features in C7 are good and well, but I just don't understand that such a fundamental issue relating to a very powerful feature has just been left broken, and rolled out in the new version.

This whole thing reminds me of the whole audio warp fiasco that became apparent when MPEX3 was introduced. It took Steinberg a good few years to get audiowarp back to a working level, and they very quietly rolled it out in C6 with the elastique audio.

Come on Steinberg, please just fix it and get the program to the level it could be at. This is such an obvious bug that adds a heap of annoying workarounds just to be able to pitch shift. The new mixer may supposably help workflow, but any timed gained with that is lost in all of my projects thanks to constant glitching of pitch shifted audio clips.

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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Merayah » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:56 am

Indeed a bug that was introduced by the elastique algo. Very annoying. But I stick with the standard-mix algo. Still works best on most kinds of audio for me.
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Re: [issue] Glitch on clip start transposed w elastique!

Post by Guest » Tue Mar 12, 2013 12:25 pm

It seems that the default algo in the audio pool is "elastique" and cannot be changed anywhere. :?

Therefore, I am constantly having to re-visit the audio pool to change the algo from "elastique" to "standard" for each new audio event that is created. Now, if you're not doing much chopping of audio events, this is only a minor PITA. However, I like to get really creative and chop/reorder/repitch quite a lot of things so it becomes a major pain in the hole. Every time I create a new audio event like this, the new events will default to "elastique", so once more I have to re-open the pool window and change them to "standard". :shock:

I have to do this for every single audio event that comes into existence.
Over and over and again and again and again and again and again. And again. :evil:

Total workflow killer! :cry:

Is there really no way to change the default algo to one that works properly?

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